CREAM DEX210 carbon front tower/aluminium mounts

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Cream

Was that needed Darren?

Yes it does cost extra, and if you use a grade that corrodes easily I guess it's needed.
I choose to use better material and not add a colour that some may or may not want.

In addition to that, yes it may look a little more trick when you first put then on, See how trick they look after a few scratches.

Noel, with respect, yes it is needed in my opinion, since every time a product comes out, that is anything like yours everyone else gets accused of copying (even in some cases if they showed off their ideas first!), despite as I have already written elsewhere, the original idea on towers with seperate alloy camber bases came from K-Factory as I pointed out a few weeks back.

Companies do copy each other yes, especially if an idea is good (all cars have four wheels at the end of the day, we will say that is copying next ) but when other brands add more in terms of anodising or etching or both it is unfair to constantly jump on a thread and insist yours are cheaper, better value and higher quality (without even knowing what grade material is used by others in some cases), I cannot speak about the Tresray "copies" of yours, but I know for a fact you have not seen the Exotek ones yet in the flesh, so how can comments be made about inferior quality materials?

Your products are superb, I am not knocking them at all, but so are many others though and competition in the market is great, you will never have the only product of a type in the market place if it is a good one, others will always attempt to make the same or similar.

If your mounts were anodised, then laser etched, then distributed through model shops and dealers all over the country (not just sold direct), I am sure they would be not too far off the price of the others too...

Not looking to argue with you, far from it, but the constant shouts of copying and comparing is really not needed.....

[jo90]

hiya, thanks for your reply. I am aware anodising costs extra, wasn't a dig at the product (as you probably saw I asked 'ARE' you able to which i note you saw). Yep I agree, scratcing does mar a product.

OK, another 'stupid' question then. The ali you use, if you 'colour' it with a black marker, does the ink seem to hold on the metal ? (some markers don't and almost streak on them).

Point is I am in the market for this kind of front setup (and rear tower) and yes im a bit fickle, i like my bits colour coded

If they hold marker pen, i will 100% be purchasing (well..the GF will be for my xmas gift)

[jo90]

PS for Darren, i am currently using Exotek items also (rear hub carriers, steering link, spring collars and shock bottoms) and all are excellent products as well.

Yes there is a tendancy of copying. In some respects it isn't even copying but actually that a main line manufacturer has parts tooled by another company who also sell under their own brand as well.

I guess its the finer changes, refinements etc that make them a companies product.

Will be in the market for spring cup's and servo posts this Xmas from Exotek also

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by jo90

hiya, thanks for your reply. I am aware anodising costs extra, wasn't a dig at the product (as you probably saw I asked 'ARE' you able to which i note you saw). Yep I agree, scratcing does mar a product.

OK, another 'stupid' question then. The ali you use, if you 'colour' it with a black marker, does the ink seem to hold on the metal ? (some markers don't and almost streak on them).

Point is I am in the market for this kind of front setup (and rear tower) and yes im a bit fickle, i like my bits colour coded

If they hold marker pen, i will 100% be purchasing (well..the GF will be for my xmas gift)

I guess Noel will answer if his alloy will take the black ink (you may be able to get the mounts anodised locally) The Cream mounts are very high quality () and in my opinion would look gtreat anodised as pherhaps a "PRO" version to satisfy theose who want colour

Another take on the DEX210 front tower is the one from Team SR (and these come with black alloy mounts too as standard -a nd pre-glued edges to the carbon tower which looks very trick) may be worth checking out also, they can be found on our website - www.xfactoryrc.co.uk

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by jo90

PS for Darren, i am currently using Exotek items also (rear hub carriers, steering link, spring collars and shock bottoms) and all are excellent products as well.

Yes there is a tendancy of copying. In some respects it isn't even copying but actually that a main line manufacturer has parts tooled by another company who also sell under their own brand as well.

I guess its the finer changes, refinements etc that make them a companies product.

Will be in the market for spring cup's and servo posts this Xmas from Exotek also

I agree with those comments fully.....

[Cream]

Originally Posted by Darren Boyle

Noel, with respect, yes it is needed in my opinion, since every time a product comes out, that is anything like yours everyone else gets accused of copying (even in some cases if they showed off their ideas first!), despite as I have already written elsewhere, the original idea on towers with seperate alloy camber bases came from K-Factory as I pointed out a few weeks back.

Companies do copy each other yes, especially if an idea is good (all cars have four wheels at the end of the day, we will say that is copying next ) but when other brands add more in terms of anodising or etching or both it is unfair to constantly jump on a thread and insist yours are cheaper, better value and higher quality (without even knowing what grade material is used by others in some cases), I cannot speak about the Tresray "copies" of yours, but I know for a fact you have not seen the Exotek ones yet in the flesh, so how can comments be made about inferior quality materials?

Your products are superb, I am not knocking them at all, but so are many others though and competition in the market is great, you will never have the only product of a type in the market place if it is a good one, others will always attempt to make the same or similar.

If your mounts were anodised, then laser etched, then distributed through model shops and dealers all over the country (not just sold direct), I am sure they would be not too far off the price of the others too...

Not looking to argue with you, far from it, but the constant shouts of copying and comparing is really not needed.....

I didn't jump on a thread, This is a thread about my product. Also didn't say they where inferior material, I said I know mine is high grade material and lower grades may need anodising to stop corrosion.

As for the black marker, If you get a marker pen that does not rub off on other alloys them it should be fine on mine, and you can always touch it up if needed.



Anyway, if you would like to purchase the original product, Please feel free to PM me, as stated they are £28.00, I also do rear towers for £15.00.


Cheers
Noel

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Cream

I didn't jump on a thread, This is a thread about my product. Also didn't say they where inferior material, I said I know mine is high grade material and lower grades may need anodising to stop corrosion.

To be fair, this is not the only thread this topic has come up on now is it and it is in the open Durango forum and not an advertisers own forum...

"if you use a grade that corrodes easily" and "I choose to use better material" is implying in my eyes that materials used by others are inferior to that of yours.

[Cream]

Originally Posted by Darren Boyle

To be fair, this is not the only thread this topic has come up on now is it and it is in the open Durango forum and not an advertisers own forum...

"if you use a grade that corrodes easily" and "I choose to use better material" is implying in my eyes that materials used by others are inferior to that of yours.

I wrote that I used a grade that doesn't need anodizing. I was very picky about what grade I used, which is why I didn't make the B4 mounts out of aluminium at first, Untill I was happy with the grade I found.

and your right it's not the first time it's come up. It's the third, as this is the third time I've seen a product that has reproduced what I developed. Such is life.

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Cream

I wrote that I used a grade that doesn't need anodizing. I was very picky about what grade I used, which is why I didn't make the B4 mounts out of aluminium at first, Untill I was happy with the grade I found.

and your right it's not the first time it's come up. It's the third, as this is the third time I've seen a product that has reproduced what I developed. Such is life.

I recall, since when the first mounts for the B4 came out they were steel and there was a heated debate about those and the weight being in the "wrong" place (if there is such as thing), hence why i think the alloy ones were introduced by you

There have been several threads with comments like these (not all of them started about your products) - here is just one example - http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111236

I think RDRP felt the same when their brass rear mounts for the DEX210 were copied after they showed them 6 months before anyone else, but as I keep saying that is life, copying will always be there

Some great examples...
MIP CVD's - copied now by almost everyone
Schumacher Mini Spike - copied more than once
Brass front bulkheads by GHEA - now everyone makes them
and with all respect - all recent cars from Ansmann/Team C are a "copy" of somthing before them

[Cream]

Originally Posted by Darren Boyle

I recall, since when the first mounts for the B4 came out they were steel and there was a heated debate about those and the weight being in the "wrong" place (if there is such as thing), hence why i think the alloy ones were introduced by you

There have been several threads with comments like these (not all of them started about your products) - here is just one example - http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=111236

I think RDRP felt the same when their brass rear mounts for the DEX210 were copied after they showed them 6 months before anyone else, but as I keep saying that is life, copying will always be there

Some great examples...
MIP CVD's - copied now by almost everyone
Schumacher Mini Spike - copied more than once
Brass front bulkheads by GHEA - now everyone makes them
and with all respect - all recent cars from Ansmann/Team C are a "copy" of somthing before them

Actually There was nothing wrong with the weight, but it's a good example as both you and Tony trashed the mounts even before they where produced. The ali ones where introduced after I found a material I was happy with and also to ease manufacture.
Most other products I produce are heavier versions of the original part. Other than the rear weight where I removed threads for ease of build and removed angles to add a little extra weight. Still don't think anyone else does that?

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Cream

Actually There was nothing wrong with the weight, but it's a good example as both you and Tony trashed the mounts even before they where produced. The ali ones where introduced after I found a material I was happy with and also to ease manufacture.

Never said there was and as for trashing them, I said they would be better in alloy, you obviuosly agreed since you then made them (and now all others since) in alloy and hence thats why we buy that great product from you and sell it with our own carbon tower, it is superb! (especially now it is in the right material for the job ) If steel was right, why no steel ones for the DEX?

Originally Posted by Cream

Most other products I produce are heavier versions of the original part. Other than the rear weight where I removed threads for ease of build and removed angles to add a little extra weight. Still don't think anyone else does that?

And as Jo90 rightly said its those fine touches that make the product your own from one company to another.

Not bashing you here Noel, I think your stuff is very good, just pointing out the facts......

[Cream]

I think I'e explained the material, I've found a grade I'm happy with.


Also the DEX210 ones would be much heavier, Much like the brass ones from 8-racing.

Anyway. Think I've said what I want to say on the subject.

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Cream

I think I'e explained the material, I've found a grade I'm happy with.


Also the DEX210 ones would be much heavier, Much like the brass ones from 8-racing.

Anyway. Think I've said what I want to say on the subject.

Glad we agree then, alloy is the better material (in this case), everyone copies everyone else's ideas and all companies make a great range of products all individual in their own little way.

Extended lunch now over, back to work...

[Welshy40]

After reading Darrens posts that has made my mind up, best quality product it is so Cream will be getting my business later this month. Cheers for that

[Cream]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

After reading Darrens posts that has made my mind up, best quality product it is so Cream will be getting my business later this month. Cheers for that

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

After reading Darrens posts that has made my mind up, best quality product it is so Cream will be getting my business later this month. Cheers for that

Like that makes any sense???

[Welshy40]

It does as you kept going so means it must be better.

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

It does as you kept going so means it must be better.

And that makes even less sense??

One thing you may not know about me, I dont hint at things, if somthing IS better than somthing else I will say, if somthing is AS GOOD AS something esle I will say that too, dont recall saying any of that above and I dont give cryptic clues.....

To clarify, all of Noels Cream stuff is very good quality, never have said it is not, but so are all RDRP, Exotek, 8Racing, K-Factory, TeamSR and others products too, all very good in their own way..

[av4625]

Darren to be fair welshy is doing that to annoy you and i dont blame him as that is not a very good way to go about anything! arguing with someone about their product on their own thread! i hav seen u say stuff about exotek and so on so i take it u sell it, their is no need to say stuff about other brands on this thread as this is about cream, its a bit like a companys website you dont want people talking about other brands on it as you want people to buy urs! ur trying to get people to buy the other brands and not cream and to be fair they pretty much did copy to bad he didnt hav copyright, and u said all companys copy thats y ther is copyright!

[Darren Boyle]

Originally Posted by av4625

Darren to be fair welshy is doing that to annoy you and i dont blame him as that is not a very good way to go about anything! arguing with someone about their product on their own thread! i hav seen u say stuff about exotek and so on so i take it u sell it, their is no need to say stuff about other brands on this thread as this is about cream, its a bit like a companys website you dont want people talking about other brands on it as you want people to buy urs! ur trying to get people to buy the other brands and not cream and to be fair they pretty much did copy to bad he didnt hav copyright, and u said all companys copy thats y ther is copyright!

Well then more fool Jamesm (welshy) since nothing has "annoyed" me.

You say it is their own thread, just wait a minute here, I access all threads via the "new posts" button on the top of the forum as I do many times daily and I am sure others do as well, this thread is in the open "Durango" forum (not a "Cream" fourm or specialist advertisers forum section, the title of the thread is simply "DEX210 carbon front tower/aluminium mounts" the thread title is NOT "CREAM DEX210 carbon front tower/aluminium mounts".

I was attracted to thread earlier last week when Noel posted that his product had been copied once more and the copy he referred to was in fact the Exotek version, you will see I had not posted anything in this thread before that accusation.

Yes indeed I do sell Exotek, in fact I do more than that, I distribute it in the UK and as such I am expecetd to back up and support the brand as with all our others if the need arises. Thier tower is not a copy of Cream, nor anyone elses, it is their own variant on a popular theme used now by many and as I have stated now many times if anyone is being copied it is in fact K-Factory who were first to do the alloy block/carbon tower design now many years ago for the B4, Noel only copied them.

I have never said that Exotek is better then Cream, nor that Cream is better than Exotek, or any of the other brands mentioned for that matter like RDRP, Team SR, 8 Racing etc etc, in fact if you read my commnets you will see that I have praised the quality of the Cream products at every oppurtunity.

Also, in my opinion it is unfair of Noel, to state on a public forum that his product is better quality (or in his words "I choose to use a better material") when he has not seen the quality of the others first hand, he has "assumed".

Yes Noels stuff is very good quality and in many cases it has been cheaper too (somtimes dearer), but to be fair I have pointed out, many of the others are laser etched and/or anodised too (which suits some and not all) and almost all of the other brnads are sold through distributors and then model shops across the country and not just direct from the supplier, which will always make them more expensive to buy. If Noel sold his to ditributors and then on to shops, his would not be as cheap as they are either....

Now I did not even realise that this thread was "Noels" at the time I first posted in it, hence if you read I put that he had "jumped on another thread", it was only when he said it was "his" thread that I realised and without it being in the title and the thread already being 7 pages long (I went straight to the last page) that was not obvious, and for that I apologise. On the other hand, many of us pay a great deal of money to Jimmy/Vicky each year for the priviledge of advertising on this forum and we have our own threads and sections to do so in, so "maybe" that is what Noel requires if he wants threads purely for promotion of his items only.

So all the talk of copying, if anyone else wishes to bring it up, please at least get your facts straight first on who is actually copying who (and yes RDRP did release the brass parts for the DEX210 first - Nov 11), the topic of quality, let customers who have the parts be the judge of that and if they feel that extra anodising or engraving etc is or is not what they want to pay extra for or not as they choose........