Vader says 'Yes' to LIPO

[Richard Lowe]

Originally Posted by xx4-nutter

i tried the team orion one at york t`other week. very fast and pick up and loads lighter in the car. i saw rich lowe in the final last saturday in 2wd mod bliping wheelies down the straight..... pretty awsome lol.

rich what turn motor was you running ?

That was my 'slow' Checkpoint 11x2 with Brett's Lipo in it, I bet it could do backflips with the Lipo and my 9x2 in
I tried to hold it on the back wheels all the way down the straight a couple of times but the lighter cells meant it was either on the wing or down lol

[super__dan]

Well you might well be interested to know I'm very much (on the face of it) being won over by this, and should there be a vote I think I'd vote to allow it (subject to BRCA insurance cover still being valid etc etc).

[jimmy]

You are welcome to borrow mine if you want a test dan

[super__dan]

Originally Posted by andys

Dan, that's possibly the most crazy thing i've read in this interesting thread ! People who attend Batley CLUB meetings are there for a bit of fun, and anything that makes things easier is a big plus in my eyes. You seem to be hung up on the it's not fair cos it's higher voltage' thing, but please spare me. I'll tell you what's not fair, and that's turning up at a batley summer outdoor meeting to be racing against mainly sponsored / supported drivers that outclass you (or rather me ) and out pace you in every respect, running lipo isn't going to make a bit of difference here and I bet I'd still get overtaken down the straight !

Andy,

I think your statement there could be interpretted a couple of ways. If you're suggesting that there are loads of sponsored club drivers at Batley who have mega speed because of it I think you're mistaken.

E.g. Rich Lowe isn't sponsored for cells or motors, Tom ran customer stuff, I actually gave up my cells/motor deal last year as it was uncompetetive comparred to off the shelf stuff.

The common thing between the three of is is that we prepare and look after stuff really well to make the most of it, it's not special stuff. I actually currently have only 1 motor (off the shelf), and one spare arm of a different wind and have done since the Euros. This is because I'm hoping to go brushless in due time. However I will miss the fact though that through good motor maintenance etc I could draw an advantage but a completely fair one! That said, it is easily outweighed by the extra time I'll have at meetings to talk random shite with my mates!

[super__dan]

Originally Posted by jimmy

You are welcome to borrow mine if you want a test dan

Cheers Jim,

Might have to try your X6 too then if you've filed the chassis to fit it?

Back to my original point though, you've got to admit your 6 gear at the vintage meeting was miles faster than anyone elses

Dan

[Medders]

What is this all about? You have batteries these days with capacities of 3700 and 4200+ and people still want more. Why most people even bother to pay for premium cells is beyond me. "Dumping" appears to be a thing of the past, and I think the attitide today towards cells is a legacy of the attitude that developed when cells meant the balance between speed and finishing the race was on a knife edge.

I would rather use (and marshall cars using) cells that were not liable to endanger my life. The sport needs rules and rules should be based on saftey and creating a standard that allows manufacturers to complete on a level playing field.

Unless you are competing at a national level time, effort and money is better spent on tyres, car set ups, and actually thinking about understanding how a car handles on any given track.

Having said all that, if Lipo is proven to be designed towards R/C racing and meets the same physical and safetly constraints imposed upon other cells then who has the right to say it is not allowed? If I can design a 540 sized nuclear powered rocket to the rear of my car then I will damn well use it - corners - who cares

[sefton]

Lets have a poll!

[andys]

Dan.

Points taken fella.
I do though think that for 'club' drivers like myself, anything that makes the hobby easier, fairer and ultimatley chaper is good news. For me a meeting isn't about who is the best mechanic, or motor tuner (and we all know some racers have dads / helpers who just do this and don't race). It's about who's best racing on the track, sure setup etc is very important, but having great cells / well maintained motors isn't always viable for everyone. I'm pretty sure that at a competitive meeting Dan your one of those people that re-brush and skim regularly, so are Tom / Rich etc. That costs a shed load ! I re-brush when the brushes are on their last legs and personally i'll be glad to see an end to this cary on, and i'll be glad to see an end to having to invest in 4/5 packs of decent cells just to be competitive. I think brushless & lipo will be a great way to level the power / performance gap between racers that we see regulaurly at club / regional meetings. I'm really confused as to why people aren't embracing this change and it seems to be the more 'serious' drivers that have reservations ?

[DCM]

your still going to have to have at least two packs of LiPo cells though, as they respond exactly like NiMH cells, the harder you charge them, the shorter a life span, and it is an exponential relatiohship in that too. Plus cells need to be cooled before recharging also.

[jimmy]

I guess we'll see how they last- thats part of using a new technology, you are discovering stuff. In my experience there is no heat on charge, discharge, charge again and again.. At least, I couldn't detect any.

I agree all the way with mr.shillito, its perfect for club racing and playing.

[bretts]

Originally Posted by Richard Lowe

That was my 'slow' Checkpoint 11x2 with Brett's Lipo in it

here's something else to think about.... Richard lap times using LiPo were the same as using his 4300's !!!!

Richard and I 'swapped' cells for the 2WD mod A final. It was a last minute decision so Richard found I as did that the car wheelied alot. Through the night I had adjusted my slipper which calmed the car down again. I used Richard's 4300 which themselves were great.

The word I used to descibe using LiPo was the car felt more 'alive' than usual.

Anyway, for all those who were there. I'm sure the best part of the night was watching me fall over after standing on Richard's car!!!

Brett

[mark christopher]

Originally Posted by DCM

your still going to have to have at least two packs of LiPo cells though, as they respond exactly like NiMH cells, the harder you charge them, the shorter a life span, and it is an exponential relatiohship in that too. Plus cells need to be cooled before recharging also.

nope not true

i have done the last biws with a 5.5 nosram and lipo, lipo charged straight after marshalling at 5 amps (not warm when they came off track) (manufacture say 2c is ok (which is ten amp)
if one pack £78 was to last 6 months (remeber there is no performance loss until they do not fade like nimh) the two times £78 is still cheaper that 5 packs at £40 which will have droped off after one year.

DCM have you tried /experienced lipo yet?

[DCM]

No, I have not tried them, only read technical specs off the web. If someone wants to send me a pack to try, free like, to change my mind....

[mark christopher]

what charger do you have? and is your speedo lipo programable for cut off?

[Adam Skelding]

Originally Posted by andys

Dan.

Points taken fella.
I do though think that for 'club' drivers like myself, anything that makes the hobby easier, fairer and ultimatley chaper is good news. For me a meeting isn't about who is the best mechanic, or motor tuner (and we all know some racers have dads / helpers who just do this and don't race). It's about who's best racing on the track, sure setup etc is very important, but having great cells / well maintained motors isn't always viable for everyone. I'm pretty sure that at a competitive meeting Dan your one of those people that re-brush and skim regularly, so are Tom / Rich etc. That costs a shed load ! I re-brush when the brushes are on their last legs and personally i'll be glad to see an end to this cary on, and i'll be glad to see an end to having to invest in 4/5 packs of decent cells just to be competitive. I think brushless & lipo will be a great way to level the power / performance gap between racers that we see regulaurly at club / regional meetings. I'm really confused as to why people aren't embracing this change and it seems to be the more 'serious' drivers that have reservations ?

Hmmm.
Only just started reading this topic. Thought I might pass on my thoughts..

Some stuff needs clarifying:
'Team' Motors
I think you'll be suprised to find that the motors that Mirage and I dare say CML and Helger send out to the 'team' drivers are actually straight off the shelf. They're in sealed boxes with no identifying marks to say team on them.

'Team' Cells
Similar thing here. They're advertised on the manufacturer's / distributors website with different performance for different budgets. From then on they are taken off the shelf in the warehouse and sent out to model shop/ customer/ 'team' driver. These all come from the same big box depeneding on the spec requested.

I've had the same nosram motors for the Last 2 years now. I've re-brushed each motor twice in that time using the P-Silver brushes. How's that for economy. Skimming usually every 3-4 runs...

If the brushes and comm are burning up much quicker your gearing really needs looking at.

Brushless.
I've only just started running brushless and have found it quite a seamless change from brushed.. Simple to use and set-up although in the XX4 the gearing is a bit of an issue as you have to use really small pinions...14/15..it's getting there.
For the beginner brushless will be amazing..and yes the performance 'advantage' will be 'minimised'. Admittedly, no more brushing & skimming.
Brushless has been a big and welcome step forward....I'm sure brushed motors will make a comeback with some new fangled "widgit".

Lipo.
It's not legal...so it shouldn't be run... on Insurance grounds.....simple. If your not aware a young lady from 1/8th was seriously injured before the Neo event charging a Lipo reciever pack...it blew up in her face....
I'm sure if this happened at a BRCA affliated club and the BRCA's insurance company decided that it was out of their hands...who would pay???? More importantly...should you risk someones health?????

Faster motors and cells I think will lead to a larger gap between racers, with those able to 'use' the extra power correctly coming to the fore..
Ok..the perceived physical performance gap maybe reduced but the actual gap will increase..

If people really believe that team drivers have that 'big' a gap in their stuff to off the shelf stuff.
Come ask me to swap cells or motors...

That's my honest opinion

[jimmy]

re: the LiPo adam, what are mirages sales figures on the orion LiPo? I know they are sponsoring a series (touring car) where LiPo is allowed.

Didn't mark post something about someone getting injured by a NiMh cell in the same way as this lady with the lipo receiver pack? The receiver packs can't be that much different to what we use in a mobile phone, but those aren't injuring people - so something obviously went wrong there.
I just think to say LiPo is unsafe and shouldn't be used, full stop - without even mentioning the serious dangers of existing battery technology, is really putting an unfair slant on things.

I don't have any desire to experience a LiPo blowing up, but equally have no desire to be near a nimh like the one below. Its terrible that someone was injured, but surely LiPo receiver packs are legal already ?

[mark christopher]

Originally Posted by Adam Skelding

Hmmm.
Only just started reading this topic. Thought I might pass on my thoughts..

Lipo.
It's not legal...so it shouldn't be run... on Insurance grounds.....simple. If your not aware a young lady from 1/8th was seriously injured before the Neo event charging a Lipo reciever pack...it blew up in her face....
I'm sure if this happened at a BRCA affliated club and the BRCA's insurance company decided that it was out of their hands...who would pay???? More importantly...should you risk someones health?????


That's my honest opinion

adam you are covered to use lipo inder general in the brca rules, been confirmed by the brca on racechat

if you are meaning Mandy the you need to correct your facts, that was a hump pack nimh and not a lipo pack. maybe nimh should be banned on those grounds?

http://www.rcracechat.com/vb/showpos...13&postcount=3

"Thankyou for your valid comments i cannot do anything at this moment in time until i know whether i gain some eyesight back after the freak accident on the 9th December when a hump pack blew through the radio box and then into my face whilst i was working on a rallyx.If and when my eyes or sight does recover and enables to me to race to a standard where i feel comfortable at again i will be out on the track.

Once again thankyou for the comments it is much appreciated

Savagemachine"



lipo is legal, no law bans it only certian sections, in fact the bikes do allow it. so they nmust be able to offer cover under the brca
the company you work for sponsors and promotes a lipo pack series!!!

[jimmy]

getting a bit heated in here play nice guys!

Thanks for clearing that up mark about the receiver pack, I should have read your post more carefully before - didn't realise that was the same incident.

[mark christopher]

jimmy im not 100% sure it is, but its the only reciever pack in a rally x car i have heard of, im noit getting heated, and adam knows me well enoughto know that.

[jimmy]

I just want to keep the love going in here