X-5 Squared Ownership

[Lee]

Personally i think your being harsh, you have probably done more harm to the X Factory name than all the positive comments on here. As they say Sh*t sticks

My opinion on x factory is the complete reverse of yours the car, team drivers and Chazz are stars, they cannot do enough to help, i asked chazz about tyres/setup on saturday for racing on dirt, sunday morning i had a reply which must of taken a fair bit of time to write. It was not a 1 liner!!

Chris,Dan and Ellis cannot do enough for you, if you had of asked one of them instead of shooting your mouth off on a public forum then they would have spent THEIR time on YOUR car. Carl even offered after you totally abused the x factory name. thats the type of people they have on board.

Also its funny how 99% of the people are happy with the car here there maybe the odd query or question but there seems to be one common problem with your car. You!

[Big E]

Originally Posted by cmgreen

X-Factory,

I bought the X-5 about 2 months ago, and thought it would be the perfect upgrade to my xx4. I have had 3 xx4 over 10 years and never really had a problem with it, except prices of parts. After 2 months of ownership (maybe more) the x5 squared will now be replaced by a b44 when it comes out.

The reason : -

The x5 squared it the fastest car i have ever driven, but also the worst. I have broken one rear shock tower every week, and a spur gear every time i go racing, one belt, and several pulleys. It will now come to a end from sunday night, when i start rebuilding the xx4, which i rarely had any problems with. And with spur gears at £11 quid each (in the UK) is it becoming very expensive (shame cause there only $11 in the states, another X-factory ripp off)

I my opinion the car is S**T, It is just 2 cars put into one and re badged, like the super aguri team in F1 ( a honda copy).

I do apolgise if i offend any x5 lovers, but this car is really P***ing me off.

Just to finish, X-factory build a car from scratch and stop ripping the uk off!

It's a shame you didn't maybe speak more to one of us team guys in the uk to take a look at your car some more before you jumped on the forum and totally laid in to a small company trying to take on the big boys, and in my opinion doing a very good job of it.

As you knew when you bought the car it was a conversion kit so really not sure what your issue with that it. Obviously there is dremelling to be done but I have never ever had a car that doesn't require dremeling in some form even when it is a production kit.

Can't see how you can blame X Factory for the rear towers, the are not made by them. If you have broken them where you dremel them then I'm afraid that is your fault as you must have removed too much material, I have broken 2 this year, one where I dremeled too much and the other was totally unrelated to the dremeled area.

As for spur gears that can only be because the motor is not clamping tightly. I take it you don't have the squared chassis as we spent a lot of time, and believe me a massive amount of money, to sort the chassis out to make it a lot better, one area that was worked was this to make the motor sit better.

In the whole year I have done one belt and one set of pulleys, both my fault as the belt was skipping due to me setting it to quickly at the euro's and it was skipping, as it was the A I kept on going and hence done the parts in.

Price wise again that is harsh, Losi parts are known to be expensive, now obviously the spur is pricey but you have to look at how much it costs to make, then import duties etc to get to the prices. Maybe they should be made in China out of paper mache and sold for free but like many people are finding stuff made in China is certainly not the best.

You last comment about building a car from scratch is also a little rich, you say you are going to buy a b44, is that not a copy of 2 other cars on the market!!! I seriously hope AE get the car right, or at least the Chinese do making it, otherwise you will be running them down as well, and I seriously hope you don't need a dremel on it either or you might sue them.

E

[bigred5765]

Originally Posted by losixxx

no he's not you know at least 2 others!!

there not unhappy just had a belt problem, all fixed now and are happy chappys

[RogerM]

I wouldn't normally come into a thread like this as I do not, have not and probably will not run the car in question however the nature of the attack is not really on.

If the car doesn't suit your driving style then change for that reason. I have been quite public in the past about how bad I thought the XX4 was to both drive (didn't suit me) and work on. I did not however slate the company who made it or try to put other racers off as it might be the right car for them.

That aside there are a couple of things that I think you have misjudged;

1) the cost of parts $ = £ is more to do with how expensive it is to import & distribute and also the various direct taxes (such as duty and VAT) that need applying. If your upset about being ripped of in Britain then I am afraid you need to take that out on the government not X Factory / Lesro as there is nothing they could do about it other than run at a loss ..... and if they were that stupid they would consider that, for what is globably speaking a small market, they would not have had the brains to build the car in the first place!!!

2) Before complaining much about the price of the bespoke parts consider how much it costs to manufacture the parts in question. A spur gear is either going to need to be cut on a mill, possibly flipped and re cut if there are features on both sides. Gear cutting plastic is a pain to do accurately and thus your never going to get a positive result from the eternal good-cheap-quick triangle (you can only ever have 2 of the 3 .... good and cheap is never going to be quick ..... quick and cheap is never going to be good).
If we are talking moulded parts then please remember that a mould tool doesn't have to get complicated to cost 10s of thousands of pounds is it is to be of high quality!!!!

3)If you have to modify parts to make them fit there should be good instrutions on how to do that without causing stress raisers in the parts in question. If that instruction is not there or not easily understandable then that is the manufacture's fault .... if you just haven't followed it then that is your fault. It must be possible to do as several people have done it successfully! The best option is for the company to modify the parts at source and then the customer only has to fit them. The problems with this are that you can then only buy them from that supplier (potentially limiting availability trackside) and also they obviously have to charge for their time in unpacking, modification and repackaging ..... that cost would HAVE to be passed on to you. If it's a simple mod then why not ask the end user to apply that modification and save themselves money??????

4)If your breaking the Losi transmission parts then how can that be the X factory's fault ...... especially when they offer an improved alternative themselves which you could have chosen to use????????


My advice my freind would be to chill out, find a car that suits you and worry about how your going to move the X5 on now you've convinced everybody YOUR car is a dog!

[super__dan]

I'm amazed by this post. I can't be arsed to start quoting all the errors in it but you surely must realise that if your car has all these reliability issues then you need to look that either something on your car is wrong or it's down to your prep.

Personally my car's tranny hasn't had any maintenance of any form since Oswestry national and I'm on the same belt and pulleys I've used all year (excepy when I changed out rear diffs rather than rebuild to save time).

I can't agree more that the newer Losi graphite is shite, but the key word there is LOSI.

[losixxx]

Originally Posted by bigred5765

there not unhappy just had a belt problem, all fixed now and are happy chappys

not on about them, myself and a n other, bought mine and returned it to x-factory when they first came out!

[Chrislong]

Originally Posted by losixxx

not on about them, myself and a n other, bought mine and returned it to x-factory when they first came out!

Well okay, I think your comment is void if your talking you and Doom. Things have changed, big time.

[losixxx]

imho chris not void at all, same thing with an x-6 i bought not so long ago. i didnt even finish building it before i was p****d off with fettling with it, don't get me wrong car is quick and handles just feel build quality is poor compared to major suppliers.

[Stu]

Unfair original post.

Anyone remember what Paul did on the Saturday at Oswestry National? What top service that was, sorting a transmission problem.

It's a shame you didn't have the chance of the same or you would not have posted what you did.

[chrispattinson]

Just a few of my comments, having been an X-5 owner. I wouldn't normally slate a company on a public forum, but it seems everyone is either slating or getting behind the company here, so I'll add my experiences.

The X-5 is by far, the worst quality kit I have had. I bought the whole X-5 car new, not a XX4 and a conversion kit.

In my opinion, the Losi and X-Factory parts were poor. Losi wishbones, Losi shock towers (not where they were dremeled), even down to snapping Losi roll pins in the wheel. X-factory pulleys were garbage - the gates on the sides of the pulleys fell off - though granted, Chris and Dan were a great help when I asked their advice, and they said they'd not seen it happen before.

Its just all the little things that added up, like the screws that tapped into the chassis to keep the bottom cover on stripped too easily.

As for general transmission, on high grip astro or grass, I got lots of belt skip, where I even had to revert to my CAT 2000 as the transmission in the cat seemed more apt at handling high grip with a 4.5 brushless.

I think you've got to admit it isnt the best quality car, but it does handle well.

I am now running a Tamiya TRF501X. The quality is so much better, it makes the X-5 look like something someone made in the garden shed. The parts are cheaper (from Brock Models in the UK) Spur gear is £3.50 compared to the X-Factory one which is over £10.

The $->£ thing doesnt work with me I'm afraid, but thats more the UK importers than anything else, dont blame the gvmt for it all, as just look at the price of the Tamiya spares I have just mentioned.

I didn't have a problem with having to dremel the pieces, infact I used a hand file. I expected this when I purchased the kit, however if someone bought the kit and didnt know this, I can see where they may be disappointed with the build.

I would even say the X-5 was of poorer quality than the old cars sitting on my shelf, inc Lazer ZXR, CAT 2000 etc., but it is a lot quicker round a track.

In the end I ditched it because of running costs and reliability, X-Factory's and Losi parts. The X-factory UK drivers are a top lot, and willing to help with the car, but it was the product itself, not the service that made me go elsewhere.

I don't usually have DNF's at meetings, but I had more DNF's with the X-factory car than all other races put together.

The Tamiya is just as quick as the X factory, but a lot cheaper to run, and is higher quality, doesn't break by just looking at it, so I'll stick with that.



Let's be fair though:
X-5 - what is good about it:

Its quick, someone else described it as a hover craft over bumps.
The shocks are good.
The Bearings are good.
The service at Lesro, X-Factory, and from Chris and Dan is very high - probably better than most others.
The belt is good
The Lesro One way unit is very good.
Its unique - lets not see a field full of B44's this year please!

On use of the forum, I believe people who have experienced the products should be able to voice their opinions of products, let's respect each others opinions.

[super__dan]

Chris,

I obviously defend my sponsor but only where I think the critisism is just and accurate.

What you have written is a (trying not to be patronising here) well writen, well reasoned post based on first hand experience. Therefore it's easy to 'accept'.

Can those cirteria be said about the following quote?

Originally Posted by cmgreen

I my opinion the car is S**T, It is just 2 cars put into one and re badged, like the super aguri team in F1 ( a honda copy).

Just to finish, X-factory build a car from scratch and stop ripping the uk off!

Not in a million years in my opinion!

[cmgreen]

Guys,

I do apologise about my post, it was not the correct way to discribe my problems with this car. If i have offended any one i would like to apologise!
Most importantly to X-Factory!

What ever problems i have had with this car i will move on and not repeat what i have written.

Many apologies

[sly]

Originally Posted by cmgreen

Guys,

I do apologise about my post, it was not the correct way to discribe my problems with this car. If i have offended any one i would like to apologise!
Most importantly to X-Factory!

What ever problems i have had with this car i will move on and not repeat what i have written.

Many apologies

To bloody late pal,
as an outsider to all this and reading the posts i think you should consider that you have seriously pi**ed alot of top lever and club level guys off.
If my cars fails it`s because of me and no one else FULL STOP.
sly

[Northy]

It's never too late to apologise, hats off for doing so.

[Spencer Mulcahy]

I for one think it takes a big man to apologise we are all guilty of going off on one about our equipment but maybe this wasnt the best place to do it. I hope you are more suited with your new ride when you get it.

[sly]

It`s all Round init.

[markwilliamson2001]

First of all, I would like to say a big thank you to Jimmy in writing his reviews of all the cars he has reviewed over the last year or more... as it has helped me make decisions on buying a car for myself.

His pictures are excellent, and he has a club racers experience level of building cars (like most of us out here). I did look at the X5 when I was coming back into 4wd off-road, but reading the review, and seeing the pictures, made me think twice about it, since it involved dremmeling certain parts (like the rear shock tower.) as well as some of the minor problems with setting the belt tension etc etc.

This put me off a little, and some of the pictures showed the quality lacked a bit when placing some of the original XX4 parts into the X5. This was down to Jimmy sanding a bit too much or cutting parts a little too much... which meant that the parts did not fit superbly (like in a full production kit).
As far as I could see the car was not for me, but for a more experienced racer/kit buider it was fine, and the speed/handling of the car cannot be bad since it has made more than one National 'A' final this year.

Most of the problems with parts come from Losi, who now have stopped making the XX4 (which is 10 years old now mind!) i.e. weak graphite parts etc.

However, reading the rest of the report, he managed to get fantastic support from the guys at Xfactory very quickly through email and the companies website. This is fantastic.

I just wish Jimmy had done a review on the Predator I bought about 6 years ago, as I probably would not have bought one because of the poorer quality compared to other manufacturer's kits (at the time). However the car was easy to drive, and setup.

Becuase they have stopped making the XX4 altogether, I am now looking possibly in a year or so to change 4wd buggy or do 2wd instead. From now on, I will be reading Jimmy's reviews with interest on any new cars that come out. I had looked at the HB D4, but am now possibly looking at something else.

I think we all can learn from Jimmy's reviews before buying a car.

Thank You Jimmy and OOPLE!

Mark

[Steve.T]

This thread makes for interesting reading since I have just bought an X5.
I have'nt run it yet but so far the service I have recieved from X factory and Lesro models has been first rate.
One thing that can be improved upon would be having to modify losi parts to fit the car.
I have built many models in my time but this was the first one I simply felt that I could not build because my skills were not up to it.
Using losi parts is not a bad thing if you do not have to modify them but surely a bespoke part would be better and if Losi are not making the xx4 any more then this is something X factory may have to look in to.
One last thing, every person who I have spoken to says this car handles and is quick.
Can't wait!!!

[YoungChazz]

Modifications to the rear shock tower, front cover, and steering tunnel are required because of the single belt drive -- we're talking physical interference here. Left alone, all those parts interfere with any single belt system. Without modifying them, you can't make a single-belt xx-4. Period.

We had a choice: increase our costs -- and yours -- $40 - 50 per Kit by making a new tower, cover, and tunnel, or let you spend five minutes with a Dremel. We chose lower costs. Many times I arrive at the conclusion that some who post on R/C forums simply have no idea of or regard for the costs of doing any business, particularly this one. Stuff ain't free.

Any new part we would mold to avoid your need to Dremel would look very like what you wind up with using your Dremel. We do not sell cars to backyard bashers. If that's your desire, we suggest you'll be far better off with an E-Max, and wish you many hours of great fun. 1/10 4WD is the F-1 of off-road.

The Family is primarily a group of committed racers who demand the most ballistic cars available. They have the experience and desire to do whatever it takes to win. It made no sense to greatly reduce potential sales in exchange for a few minutes with a Dremel.

And the fact is that these modifications are rather simple, requiring just a minute or two each and the most basic of Dremel tools. Pertsonally, I find the steering tunnel easiest to screw up -- the shock tower's a breeze. Most of the Family recognizes why Dremelling is necessary and just does it. We hear very few complaints. The instructions are clear -- most reviewers comment that ours are the best instructions they have ever used.

BTW. The Family Rocks!!! Working with and for X Factory's customers is a daily joy.

[YoungChazz]

I'm not dissing you, Steve. I just re-read what I wrote, and stand by every word. It was purposely written in general terms, not specific to you or any other single person. We're glad you're part of The Family, and hope you have many hours of great fun with the fastest R/C car in the world.

I'll go on for a moment regarding our concept of just who the Family is. As I said, we think our customers are passionate experienced racers. They spend hours each week working on their cars, which they find as enjoyable as driving them. If that were not so, they'd buy an RTR.

The Family is proud to have cars featuring advanced engineering which gives them a distinct racing edge. Nothing else is like either X Factory car, and while the others scramble to copy our ideas we're conceiving entire new concepts of how to make four wheels go fast, utilizing much input from The Family. That input comes in every day in lots of different ways.

That's what makes X Factory so different: we realize and appreciate that The Family has far more ideas than we could ever have. So we solicit those ideas and act on them, changing our products as we go. Right now, with the X - 6, it's actually hurting sales, but we don't care -- for some tracks the car will be faster.

Part of the 4-gear delay has been significant additional work to completely change the rear shock tower. This involved scrapping an expensive mold and producing a new one plus finding two new suppliers and beginning the process of designing and working with both of them. The expense has included several trips to California, all worth it because the X - 6 will be a better car. The entire rear shock tower concept came from The Family.

There's no "Here it is, take it or leave it" to X Factory cars. We want you to take a Dremel to them, to grab a sheet of material and make your own parts. Then tell us about it, what works and what does not. If it doesn't work, tell us what you were trying to accomplish; either way maybe we can recognize a problem we didn't know existed and come up with a different way to make the car faster.

Like I said above, working with The Family makes going to work every day a real joy. Thank you to all The Family for pushing us to excell and for the mountains of help. Your intensity and passion, your happiness when it all works right, keeps us pushing 7 days a week to go faster. Who needs NASCAR on TV when we've got all this?