Lazer ZX-S

[Dyna]

Fantastic

Can you give the details of the parts shop please ?

[pUs]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

I know I am not the only one who knows a lot but I do know a lot about this car as I am still racing it, in fact how many others are?

Thanks, I already know you are racing it, we've communicated quite a lot concering Lazers on other forums during the past years.

Thats gotta show quality straight away.

Well.. I remember reading in another thread about how Ellis Stafford supposedly 'lapped' the whole field during the '92 Euro's etc and having a laugh when reading about the actual race in an old RCMC issue a while later.. you tend to exaggerate sometimes when Lazers are being discussed. Sure, he won, but in reality it was slightly tighter than that.

I agree and did say that its down to the individual what they want to pay, I got one for the going rate and was a bit disappointed with the chassis more than anything, yes its a one piece but you have to glue the servo to it which is not a good idea, hence why the evo is better.

Well yeah, it's a little messy way of attaching the servo, but it's no problem if you do it correctly. Much like on the YZ-10 at the same time, there wasn't much space on the chassis plate to mount it in any other way. Still never had a servo coming loose during racing..

Also would be interested if anyone out there who has a ZX-S with a sticker sheet could take a picture of the sticker sheet and post it, so I can get it made for the buggy in the box, I used all of my stickers years back. Thanks.

I'm pretty sure Tomas could scan his stickers for you if you ask him really politely

[Welshy40]

Ellis did i believe from memory the only 15 lap qualifier and was a lap ahead of the competition. I cant remember it all but he was in a different league at that event with the zxr.

[Welshy40]

If that shop has these items in stock then great but if they are looking at what kyosho have then be warned that they might not be there. Still if they are bang on. What part numbers did u ask for by the way?

[pUs]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

Ellis did i believe from memory the only 15 lap qualifier and was a lap ahead of the competition. I cant remember it all but he was in a different league at that event with the zxr.

Yup, he did, a slow 15 lapper. However, next best qualifier missed out on 15 laps by 1 second.. a total of 2.5 seconds down the road.

Also, Craig Drescher actually beat his time, but was disqualified since scrutineers found his car too wide. Still impressive results, but by no means in a different league. Everybody sitting on the outside of the dusty grid were heavily penalised in the finals, as could be seen by the final results..

Honourable mention to Lee Wright as well, he put a near standard Top Force Evolution in 4th spot in qualifying. Ended up way below that in the final standings though.

[Welshy40]

I still think Jamie Booths Top force was stunning on the day, especially at the euros. God I am showing my age a bit now.

[Tjompa]

Welshy, i sold this car on ebay yesterday and the price you did told me is just a joke, thank god i wasn´t ripped off by you or somebody else, i did get 1000USD for the car and it was sold quickly.
I think you know what youre talking about and please be a little more honest next time a clueless person walks in to the oople office.
I know where to find parts for the car but i keep that as a secret of my own.

[purpletimbo]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Kyosho-Lazer-ZX-...3A1%7C294%3A50

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by Tjompa

Welshy, i sold this car on ebay yesterday and the price you did told me is just a joke, thank god i wasn´t ripped off by you or somebody else, i did get 1000USD for the car and it was sold quickly.
I think you know what youre talking about and please be a little more honest next time a clueless person walks in to the oople office.
I know where to find parts for the car but i keep that as a secret of my own.

You actually found someone willing to pay that amount. Well good on you, I still cant believe any one would pay that, still they did and you have now made some money so well done. You must remember I race these, and they are not going to be very rare soon as you can now almost make one yourself for no more than £350.00. All carbon fibre parts are readily available from Fibre-lyte and the plastic bits will sooner or later be made, plus the drive train items with exception of the belts which shouldnt be too hard to source. Soon these things wont be worth that much. Sorry but thats a fact. But I am gob smacked that someone paid that for just a standard ZXS which is not as rare as the ZX-S Evo. I thought my car was rare so wonder how much I would get for mine, and I originally thought £500 was a good price, maybe I should go for £2500.

[Tjompa]

Hehe let´s try Welshy!

[gps3300]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

You must remember I race these, and they are not going to be very rare soon as you can now almost make one yourself for no more than £350.00.......Sorry but thats a fact. But I am gob smacked that someone paid that for just a standard ZXS

Welshy, you aren't really clued up on this collecting thing are you? A hard core collector has obviously valued Tjompa's car at $990 because it's original and new in box, and very, very rare indeed. A repro with modern parts made by Fibre-lyte + others will never be worth anywhere near as much! Even with the ability in 2009 to recreate a new ZX-S, I doubt if the "For Sale" section will be swimming in them as most people have got better cars/things to spend their money on....

[Welshy40]

Originally Posted by gps3300

Welshy, you aren't really clued up on this collecting thing are you? A hard core collector has obviously valued Tjompa's car at $990 because it's original and new in box, and very, very rare indeed. A repro with modern parts made by Fibre-lyte + others will never be worth anywhere near as much! Even with the ability in 2009 to recreate a new ZX-S, I doubt if the "For Sale" section will be swimming in them as most people have got better cars/things to spend their money on....

I understand that these were built to be raced and not left in a box unbuilt. Thats why i race mine and understand to some degree why this buggy was built due to learning how it works properly. Yes one i have is unused but thats spares when mine ever run out. Still how many unused prototypes are there? Also worth pointing out fibre lyte make a better product than what comes with the zxs.

[gps3300]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

I understand that these were built to be raced and not left in a box unbuilt.

Hmm..that's what I mean - you're a racer not a collector. I respect anyone who puts time & effort into racing a vintage buggy...especially something expensive like your ZX-S's. However by suggesting Tjompa's car was worth £200 you made yourself look rather silly / trying some kind of scam to devalue it.....

[Si Coe]

I've sold a couple of rare items recently that in hindsight I could say I regret how little they went for. Indeed, I recently sold a Cougar 2000 shell and undertray here on Oople that is now on Ebay for considerably more than he paid me for it.

Am I angry? Not really. After all these things are worth only what someone is willing to pay for them. A collector who desparately wants that one last item to complete a collection is willing to pay a lot more than most of us, but only if that person spots the item you are selling. Even then you need at least 2 such motivated people to drive the price up.

The point is Welshy couldn't think why anyone would want to pay more than £200 for it, and the fact is most people wouldn't. You found one, and got a pretty sum for it. Be pleased, but realise you were lucky, thats all.......

Editted - Just to say I'm really not at all bothered. I wouldn't want anyone to think I was bad mouthing a fellow Oopler. He didn't expect it would go for so much either!

[Funkymojo]

I totally agree with you Si Coe...As for you Tjompa, i'm really happy you got a good price for it, i remember telling you on Rctech that you could get it for a good price if you put it on ebay...To be fair, the ZXS is a rare buggy and yes it does command a high price but i've seen some on ebay that went for less than £200 and some went as high as £500. For vintage kits, there isn't a fixed price on it, it all depends how much a collector is willing to pay for it and how desperately he wants to own it. I've seen brand new built mint condition Tamiya Egress going for crazy prices while i got mine from a local ex Tamiya team driver with lots of prototype parts and tons of spares for free and the condition is top notch. To many collectors, the Egress is a collector's dream but to the ex Tamiya team driver, it's taking up space in his room and it's an old outdated worthless buggy..lol..Prices of vintage kits are so expensive due to demand, if there was never a demand, the prices would never ever reach sky high. Collectors determine the prices of these kits. As for Welshy40, i've known him for quite some time, a really nice and helpful chap. We've spoken and dealt many times, always full of advice and willing to help. He has owned many Lazers...and has own a couple of ZXS and ZXS Evo..well maybe he's lucky cause he never paid a premium for his ZXS hence that is why he couldn't justify paying so much for one. As for the 2 ZXS Evo prototypes that he owns, that's a different story altogether. There are no more than 5 made and he has 2 with him. Now talking about price, well it depends how much a person is willing to pay for them, to a die hard Kyosho fanboy, as long as budget allows, i'm sure he will pay Welshy40 a small fortune for it but to a non collector, i don't think he would even pay £50 for an old buggy, so the bottom line is that it still boils down to how much and how badly a person wants a kit. Well Oople is my favourite forum and everyone here is really nice and helpful, even the Factory Team drivers over here are nice and helpful, so it's really sad to see fellow Oople members calling each other names...All i can say is that James aka Welshy40 is definately no scammer and is a nice chap. He's one guy i will definately trade, buy, sell with. Cheers

[gps3300]

OK, I didn't mean to make it sound like Welshy is a scammer, was just trying to point out that a collecters mentality is different from a racer's point of view, and his point of view isn't always right. Funkymojo summed it up much better in his post. No harm meant Welshy, and as I mentioned, I respect you for putting the effort in to racing the old Lazer's against modern machinery...

[Welshy40]

No problems at all. This is a forum afterall and opinions count. Its a bit of fun and everyone here must enjoy it, i do. Talking on the zxs again, i have a few items in the pipeline and if my idea does go to paper then i will update you. This is why i like this hobby, you can always better something with a bit of patience and persistance. Updates should be soon but this will interest everyone from collectors to racers. That should keep you thinking.

[HKP]

indeed collecting is a funny old market.. some things are worth far more to some people than others. Welshy, with 2 (or is it 3?) Lazers probably won't value this kit as highly as others who haven't got one and really really want one!!

Good luck to Tjompa.. you sold the right car at the right price and fair play to you sir! If you can't make an honest buck what can you do?!!





p.s. I have a Lazer ZX-S too... and 2 ZX-Rs...

[kek23k]

Originally Posted by HKP

p.s. I have a Lazer ZX-S too... and 2 ZX-Rs...

Any pics?

[terry.sc]

Originally Posted by Welshy40

I understand that these were built to be raced and not left in a box unbuilt.

That's the point. Tjompas car is still in the box and that will always attract a huge premium over a built car to a collector and I would say the price he got was about right, maybe more if sold at the right time. After all there's, relatively speaking, plenty of built examples around, but very few still in the box untouched. The exact same kit when freshly built and not run would be worth no more than $400-500. There's also the fact it's a NIB ZX-S, not an Evo. The Evo might be a better car on the track, but for a collector it doesn't have the history to go with it that the ZX-S does.

Rarity doesn't guarantee a high price for collectors, it's the desirability that does. Look at Tamiyaclub, on ebay the most expensive vintage r/cs are the Sand Scorcher, Rough Rider, Hilux and Bruiser, yet they are 4 of the top 6 most popular chassis owned in Tamiyaclubs showrooms.

Also worth pointing out fibre lyte make a better product than what comes with the zxs.

That's irrelevant, a collector will want it as it originally came. A car with a little used original chassis with a few scratches will be worth more than one with a brand new Fibrelyte replacement, collectors want it to be as original as possible.

There's a world of difference between vintage collecting and r/c racing. It's like the Rough Rider rerelease, it will have little effect on the vintage r/c market as there are so few parts that are the same as the original, so collectors will still want the older, less robust original parts even for their runners, and there's a lot of us vintage fans having no interest in it because there's so many differences.