Back after 20 years. Advice please

[AndyF]

Hi,

Not raced since the days of my procat (which I still have).

Thinking of getting a cheap 2wd car and like the look of that madrat. I have seen that everyone is running brushless motors and lipo batteries.

Now I don't want to race straight away and the car will be played with by my kids as well. So I was thinking, why don't I stick to NiMh Cells for which I already have a charger (20 years old but still appears to work) and brushed motors which appear very cheap these days.

So would the following mega cheap combination work for an 8 year old and a very rusty 36 year old to have some fun.

Motor
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWNX:IT

Will be as fast as my old procat with the 18T motor I had in that I would think.

Speed controller
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/DC-motor-speed...item3f096ecd7f

This seams impossibly cheap compared to the prices I remember, do they actually work? I could use my old silverstar but i'm betting it will be a bit big and long in the tooth.

Cells
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/4x-7-2V-3800mA...item4aa949f984

You couldn't get one pack of 1700mAH cells for that the last time i bought some.

Radio

I would just use my old 27MHz trany, receiver and servo from the procat. I powered them up with some old cells and they appeared to still work. If I did decide to race again, I assume 27MHz is still legal?

Cheers guys.

[colmo]

Having been down this route myself, I'd have to say not to bother with brushed gear (at least not new), and at least consider Lipos.

I think that speedo is for a plane, so no brakes!

Brushless is not expensive, at least for modest winds, if you know where to look. The used section is filled with ESCs from a year or two ago that are still excellent for a beginner/returnee - ~£90 would see you right for a combo. Treat the motor right (don't cook it) and it'll last forever. Look up Inix Racing for £60 combos - something around 8.5 would be fine on a 2wd. Giantcod have the Justock and Xtreme Stock (the latter has tricks to make a modest motor very fast!) and some ultra cheap sensored brushless motors. Hobbywings Xerun and EZRuns are all over ebay (unfortunately, lots of fakes!)

Post in the wanted section, and you'll get offered plenty of brushed gear, good spec, for essentially sweet FA. Its worthless for most forms of racing.

Lipos are a more hefty initial investment, but one good lipo pack will outlive the 4 NiMhs you linked. I'll refer you to the For Sale forum again - lots of stick packs going as most chassis now use saddle. Going budget on these is a less good idea, but Intellect hardcases are reasonable. The charger will be a one-off up-front cost too. If I was going NiMh, look up Vapextech - £10 a pack iirc, pretty good quality afaik.

[David Church]

A definite no for NiMh's in my opinion.
There not worth it.
A lipo is far better, more runtime, easier to manage as well, and you can pick up a lipo charger for not alot of money.
Brushless is a must, again it makes life so much easier.
27 meg are fine.
The Madrat, well I have heard alot about them, both good and bad.
A second hand B-4 would probably be a stronger option.

I wouldnt touch the electrics and cells you have put links too.

I would look at getting some second hand stuff from this site instead, you can find very good value.

[rondoolaa]

i'll 2nd the above about a b4,
a team associated b4 is a great choice as parts are easily available if you or you son bash it and its a very fast car even with basic radio gear and batteries,

my 7 yr old son has one, it has a £6 standard 540 brushed motor and a £15 speed controller 1400 to 3800 mah nicd and nimh batteries and its fast enough for him, in fact its pretty rapid, and he also uses my 20 yr old futaba attack sr 27mhz radio gear.


also with it being your son i would go against the lipo option as if he is playing out in garden with car and takes the cells too low, which kids playing might do, then thats it, throw it away and buy another cell, unless of course you invest in a speedo with cut off points...

nicd or nimh, you can run till the car comes to a standstill and they are still ok, thats why i use them for my son,

[F1END]

I was in a similar situation a year or 2 ago.

I'd recommend going lipo/brushless straight off the bat. I didn't, then ended up buying a brushless system and lipos anyway, and wasted my money.

Second hand (either on here or on ebay) you should be able to get ESC, Motor, Battery and charger for around £150-£200 (possibly less).

[AndyF]

Thanks guys,

I hear what you are saying about the lipo/brushless combination and not having to go out and buy them anyway in 6 months time. My feeling was that I won't be racing to start with and possibly ever and I could get the lot including car for £90.

I kind of want a new car to build from the box as that's part of the hobby (hence not going rtr) and the mad rat is both cheap and appears to have good spares support. I can't find a B4 for less than a £100 and although they may well be worth that and more with the hop ups they all have, it wouldn't be a new build. I only just noticed you get a 23T motor with the kit.

Going to have a good look at the sales section and see what brushless combos are on offer. (make sure I don't get one for a plane )

Still a little unsure on the lipo front. All this balance charging and minimum discharge voltage not to mention charging in a bag sounds complicated for an old man! When I raced I just charged my batteries before I left the house, used them at the track with a little top up to be sure and then forget them until the next race or I took it out in the garden.

Help me! I'm turning into my Grandad and resisting all change!

[bigred5765]

having said that nimh are even more hassle than the old yellow stick 1700 sce were there a one charge one used deal per day,cant be stored flat or fully charged and really only safe for one use per day, and are known for going bang, get a cheap lipo and charger you can charge top up and used as many times a day as u like we race at nationals with one lipo both days 2wd and 4wd no hassle,and brush less is a must no skimming or changing brushes,browse the for sale section theres loads up for sale,

[damselfly]

I amongst other cars own a Mad Rat and am more than happy with it.
It's really quite robust imo, and the accident I had with it today is testament to it.
Lots of people slate Ansmann obviously believing they've not shaped up since the days of the Master Smacker and Royal flash both of which are crap, apparently.
Both the Mad Rat and Mad Monkey would be well suited to a beginner and many people race them to good effect I believe.

[David Church]

Its very simple Andy, get a lipo, a lipo charger, and a brushless motor and speedo with a low voltage cutoff. This means your speedo detects when your lipo has a low charge and shuts the car off. And does not damage the lipo.
As far as charging and balancing goes, its very much the same thing. The only difference to you as a user is you plug in an extra wire to balance charge the lipo.
You see there is charge the lipo, and balance charge the lipo, both are charging, I have never really noticed a difference though.

It takes a bit to get up to speed with all the understanding of this stuff, but I am an oldie as well so dont be afraid to ask, oh and by the way I am the bollocks so all you kids out there can just do 1........mmmwwwhhaaaaaaaa

[AndyF]

Ok, Holidays etc over. Back to getting this sorted.

Seams Lipo and brushless the way to go. You have convinced me J any recommendations? Need this lipo cut off business on the speedo. Also would one of these B6 chargers that there are hundreds of on ebay do the job for a balance charger?

I have another question. My radio gear is very old 27MHz stuff. I decided I want to go 2.4GHz and not worry about all that crystal stuff anymore. I'm used to sticks, never used a wheel in anger. I reckon I would like a stick 2.4GHz transmitter, receiver and suitable servo.

Any recommendations?

What is the difference between a "normal servo" and a digital one? I assume a digital signal is sent from the receiver and as such you need a digital receiver?

[VintageRacer]

I can't answer all of your questions, I'm in a similar situation. My son was given a vintage Grasshopper recently which has inspired me to clean up and get my old Optima back on the road.

I've not tried them myself but I've read good things about the Core RC and Etronix stick radio sets (the new ones with the blue reciever seems the better system, FHSS I think). Both are the same, just re-badged. There is a £40ish set with little setting adjustments whereas the £80ish set has more adjustments than I would know what to do with.

I think any modern servo will work with any modern receiver, but I am happy to be corrected (a new servo may be my next purchase!).

I should add, I've bought a used Novak GTB esc and LRP brushless motor from here which are yet to be used in the car seem easy enough to use during my quick try out of the car.

[jim76]

the madrat is a solid car, and can be very competitive at club and regional level. The only things you need to do to it are ballrace it for about £8, and replace the kit shocks at the tops fall off all the time.
Pick up some second hand alloy shocks such as B4 shocks, then the car is very good.

Also lipo and brushless are the way forward, much less hassle to maintain.

[jmke]

Originally Posted by AndyF

What is the difference between a "normal servo" and a digital one? I assume a digital signal is sent from the receiver and as such you need a digital receiver?

here's good link explaining the differences: http://www.rchelicopterfun.com/rc-servos.html