Setups

[Lowie]

I will have the oportunity to drive/train on the dirt-track on Stokrooie in Belgium tomorrow.
Any idea which setup I could use for the X11 '08?

It's dirt, sometimes very rutten, with a table, wall of death, tight corners ... in short: a splendid circuit

Pictures can be found in this thread

(I thought I allready asked this info overhere, but seem not able to find it)

[Lowie]

... pushrod lenth 23mm with shockball undone 1turn....

What do you mean with shockball undone 1turn, Nathan?and also, could you, in some way, show us where exactly the new hole was drilled in the Wishbone.
I guess it's a the edge of the webbing?

[niggs98]

Originally Posted by Lowie

What do you mean with shockball undone 1turn, Nathan?and also, could you, in some way, show us where exactly the new hole was drilled in the Wishbone.
I guess it's a the edge of the webbing?

i run justr on the thin part of the webbing. kev runs further out. i will get a measurment after the weekend as im not gonna get the time on my cars as it is.

shock ball undone 1 turn means 1 thread showing on the shock shaft ball joint

[Lowie]

this comes from the Worksop-setup, Nathan:

no washer under outer point hub in lowwered position

Do you mean by that:
No cone washer between the upright (hub?) and the ball joint on the top side
and
on the bottom side of the upright: a washer UNDER the balljoint, so that the upright is in it's lowest position?


ps: remember my diff-problems at EIR, and the fact that we (you) had to use more then 3 shms to shim y diff correctly?
Rebuild my car once more and found out that one of the rear diff bushes is worn out (must have had a nasty hit, some of the metal border was bend), which causes extra slack.

[blitzboy]

i think nathan means the under side of the hub mate , itryed it and it was brilliant , oh yer your shells in the post too mate

[niggs98]

Originally Posted by Lowie

this comes from the Worksop-setup, Nathan:
Do you mean by that:
No cone washer between the upright (hub?) and the ball joint on the top side
and
on the bottom side of the upright: a washer UNDER the balljoint, so that the upright is in it's lowest position?


ps: remember my diff-problems at EIR, and the fact that we (you) had to use more then 3 shms to shim y diff correctly?
Rebuild my car once more and found out that one of the rear diff bushes is worn out (must have had a nasty hit, some of the metal border was bend), which causes extra slack.

no washer between the upright is the upper outer point as i often run this low to calm the car down on power (to get the steering balance i like on the car)
hub low means a washer below the lower mount as this give more steering in general (after getting the balance i like i can then add more steering to get the car quicker in the low speed corners and gain pivot)

the worn/bent bush explains a lot as to the problems you had that day. will chat to you on msn about it

[Lowie]

thx Nathan, for clarifying

I also tried to build the "new pushrod".
It was a bit tricky to find away to mount this shorter pushrod, keeping it clear from the axe.
I guess the mounting-position with a servo-post as described here is a very good and maybe the best idea. I will order em some of thsese posts but in the mean time the new mounting position I build will have to do.

A remark, though. These shorter psuhrods are build using the rear-toe-turnbucles. But these turnbucles are only 30 mm long and that's a bit short I think.
I allready consulted the lunsford-website for some 40 mm turnbucles with diameter of 3mm but these donot seem to exist. Pitty.

[niggs98]

Originally Posted by Lowie

thx Nathan, for clarifying


A remark, though. These shorter psuhrods are build using the rear-toe-turnbucles. But these turnbucles are only 30 mm long and that's a bit short I think.
I allready consulted the lunsford-website for some 40 mm turnbucles with diameter of 3mm but these donot seem to exist. Pitty.

personally i use a shorter link than standard. (one off my old x6) but have also seen others use the rear tow in link with out issues. once assembled check your droop and suspension travel. i tend to shorten my push rod untill the front tyres will still just lift off the floor by 1-2mm when the car is pushed flat down

[Lowie]

Originally Posted by niggs98

...
once assembled check your droop and suspension travel. i tend to shorten my push rod untill the front tyres will still just lift off the floor by 1-2mm when the car is pushed flat down

Don't you mean the front tyres lift 1-2mm when the car is lifted off the table?
if I understand this correctly, I guess you mean there is 1 - 2 mm droop (or downstop) and that confuses me because this sounds a rather short droop-setting and I thought to have understood that more droop = better.

Or do you mean that there is only 1 - 2 mm upstop in stead of downstop?
That you drop the car on the table so that it's sets itself and you then push the car down, and the wheels only lift for 1 - 2mm until it touches the end of the shocktravel and blocks?

how much droop to you look for in the rear-section (depending on track-conditions, I guess)?

[niggs98]

on the front when i push the car down flat to the table the wheel still lifts 1-2mm before all the shock travel is taken

as for droop on the rear i equal the droop so that the bud cap in no way leaves the drive cup but is very close to the edge on full down droop. if the blade comes out of the cup at all (even only 1-2mm) it kills the budcap very quicky and then the outdrive as well

[Lowie]

okaaay I see now. So you set up to a maximum downstop (with the bud caps as a reference point) and an "up-stop" of "flat + 1-2mm"

[restimax]

any one have tried this mod at the front pushrod in outdoor track?or in slippery track?
with this the front have more steering at the low speed corners...ok but te car is more easy to driver in slippery track or nothing?

[niggs98]

Originally Posted by restimax

any one have tried this mod at the front pushrod in outdoor track?or in slippery track?
with this the front have more steering at the low speed corners...ok but te car is more easy to driver in slippery track or nothing?

the extra droop on the rear and changed pushrod pointon the front do generate more mechanical grip in slippery conditions max

[Lowie]

I went to drive yesterday on a dirt-muddy track of Stokrooie (Belgium) ... and indent to go back this afternoon.

I especially drove with the stock pushrod yesterday so that I could compare the car with the shorter pushrod.

I'll post my findings, for what they are worth, this evening.

[Lowie]

Setup for Stokrooie (Belgium)
Dirt-track.
Conditions: sunny after some days of raining, 12°C
moist dirt, loose in the corners, bumpy.

* Front *
top mounting: no cone washer
bottom mounting: Upright in low position, washer onder Ball joint (*)
Camber: 1,5°
Caster: 1 washer behind
Shock: 40wt, 2 X 0.96 holes, no valve, 13,5mm clips, 5.5 spring (= blue)
short pushrod 23mm
height: 20 mm (**)
Toe: 0.5° OUT each
no roll bar
tyre: Losi 4WD Stud Red (Losa7282) ... gave a heavy steering car
Losi Blockhead Red (Losa7283) better in balance but less steering
standard front wing


* Rear *
upright in lower hole
Camber: 1,5°
Shock: 35wt, 2 x 0.96 holes, Precompr + silver (= white), Long shockshafts (aero?), middle position shock mount
Height: 23mm (**)
Toe: 2° IN each
tyre: Losi 4WD Stud (Losa7364)
large rear wing with half guerney
soft roll bar


* car *
Pred X11-08
short pushrod-mod
Stickpack(Lipo)-mod
Weight: (with 40gr in the front + 70 gr in the middle) fully equiped: 1640gr
ESC: Tekin RS Pro - (***)
Motor: LRP X11 6.5
Spektrum
schumacher blue inserts
tires: X11-rims but two inner rings cut away


(*) Front Upright slightly modded, so that the ball joint can also be mounted in a higher position and thus lowering the uprights position. (Credits go to Nathan )

(**) Height was ok, since the tracks had lots of holes and was very bumpy but I think he car can be lowered

(***) Tekin soft version 189
15 - 100 - 100 - 11 - BL-DL - 5 - 2 - Off - 78 - off

[Lowie]

Originally Posted by restimax

any one have tried this mod at the front pushrod in outdoor track?or in slippery track?
with this the front have more steering at the low speed corners...ok but te car is more easy to driver in slippery track or nothing?

I tested my X11 yesterday on the Stokrooie-track and today again, but with the short Pushrod-mod.
It definitely made the car easier to drive and added a lot of steering!
It's a keeper for me

but! on a rather heavy contact with the boarding (on the half-pipe), the shorter pushrod-turnbuckle stripped loose from the top ball-joint. The turn-buckle was only turned into the ball-joints for 3mm, which seems rather short IMHO.
I'm looking for some longer 3mm turnbuckles but have not found any yet

[KevLee]

Originally Posted by Lowie

I tested my X11 yesterday on the Stokrooie-track and today again, but with the short Pushrod-mod.
It definitely made the car easier to drive and added a lot of steering!
It's a keeper for me

but! on a rather heavy contact with the boarding (on the half-pipe), the shorter pushrod-turnbuckle stripped loose from the top ball-joint. The turn-buckle was only turned into the ball-joints for 3mm, which seems rather short IMHO.
I'm looking for some longer 3mm turnbuckles but have not found any yet

Hi Lowie,

Glad you like the mod, i'm using losi xxx (cr, bk2) rear turnbuckles with a little ground off each end, and not had any problems since i started running with the new position.

Kev

[restimax]

Originally Posted by Lowie

I tested my X11 yesterday on the Stokrooie-track and today again, but with the short Pushrod-mod.
It definitely made the car easier to drive and added a lot of steering!
It's a keeper for me

but! on a rather heavy contact with the boarding (on the half-pipe), the shorter pushrod-turnbuckle stripped loose from the top ball-joint. The turn-buckle was only turned into the ball-joints for 3mm, which seems rather short IMHO.
I'm looking for some longer 3mm turnbuckles but have not found any yet

Hi mate,
do you have used the rear toe link turnbuckle of pred?i have try with this...but the up balljoint is mounted under the crank...and the lenth is 20mm for me.

[Lowie]

yup, i indeed used a Pred-rear-toe-turnbuckle.
Might try the one thatMr Lee suggested or try mounting it under the crank.
That second option might as well be a solution for the very steep angle at which it is not so simple to mount that pushrod.
Would the functioning stay the same?

Here are some more pics of the actual mounting (that i took during cleaning):

[Lowie]

I have yet another question.

I changed one of the rear upper ball joints because it had to much slop and had quite some wear from the rim.
This is how the new ball joint looked like after one afternoon of training:


.. again quite some wear.
The rim simply eats away the ball joint. Can't be good

Is there a way to prevent this? ... without changing the driving-properties of the car ?