Interesting aircon issue

[Chris56]

Following my earlier pursuit to buy a fast saloon, I recently set down a deposit on a Saab 9-5 Aero. Im still awaiting to collect the car as im waiting for the v5 back for my part ex after removing the private plates (bloody DVLA!!)

The car is in immaculate condition, except for the fact that the aircon was not blowing icy cool air, however the dealer has agreed to get this fixed before delivery and we suspected it was going to be a simple re-gas (given that there were no electrical faults showing and the compressor was working fine).

The dealer took the car to Kwik fit for a regas. The confirmed that there were no leaks and that the system was pulling a decent vacuum. However, following the re-gas, the aircon was only marginally cooler.

The dealer took the car to another (this time "proper") garage today, where they could not find any leaks, however it took them 2 attempts to re-gas the system. The result was an icy-cool aircon system.

However, on driving the car back the dealer noticed a faint "mist" of gas in the cabin, that was only visible due to the bright sunlight. The car was returned to the garaged where they have now discovered a tiny leak coming from where the evaporator is. It should be fixed by tomorrow - hopefully just a seal but at worst a new evaporator.

Has anybody experienced any similar issues with their aircon systems, or is this quite an odd one?

Apart from the aircon, the car is in superb condition and is a real testiment to it's previous owner. Having 250 Bhp on tap really blew my head off!

[Col]

My old vectra was like that. I sold it.

[daz]

Originally Posted by Col

My old vectra was like that. I sold it.

And like a daft twat, you bought another Vauxhall

[Rich D]

Originally Posted by Chris56

Following my earlier pursuit to buy a fast saloon, I recently set down a deposit on a Saab 9-5 Aero. Im still awaiting to collect the car as im waiting for the v5 back for my part ex after removing the private plates (bloody DVLA!!)

The car is in immaculate condition, except for the fact that the aircon was not blowing icy cool air, however the dealer has agreed to get this fixed before delivery and we suspected it was going to be a simple re-gas (given that there were no electrical faults showing and the compressor was working fine).

The dealer took the car to Kwik fit for a regas. The confirmed that there were no leaks and that the system was pulling a decent vacuum. However, following the re-gas, the aircon was only marginally cooler.

The dealer took the car to another (this time "proper") garage today, where they could not find any leaks, however it took them 2 attempts to re-gas the system. The result was an icy-cool aircon system.

However, on driving the car back the dealer noticed a faint "mist" of gas in the cabin, that was only visible due to the bright sunlight. The car was returned to the garaged where they have now discovered a tiny leak coming from where the evaporator is. It should be fixed by tomorrow - hopefully just a seal but at worst a new evaporator.

Has anybody experienced any similar issues with their aircon systems, or is this quite an odd one?

Apart from the aircon, the car is in superb condition and is a real testiment to it's previous owner. Having 250 Bhp on tap really blew my head off!

Most cars require dash out to replace the evaporater although i confess to knowing little about Saab. Its a major job if so. We dealt with Volvo/Renault/Peugeot primarily. It wasnt uncommon. It may of been an oil mist that you saw but if thats the case the leak must of been a big one. The evaporater is the low pressure side of the system. The refrigerant is odourless, non flammable, non toxic etc, you wouldnt be able to see it unless it was pissing out as fast as they were filling it Was there any standing pressure in the system before you took it to the garage the first time ?

Not done any vehicle A/C for a long time now, we used to do all the local dealership stuff before the advent of the all in one machines that most places now have.

[Chris56]

Hi Rich, thanks for the info.

I didn't actually take the car the the garage -it was the dealer so I am only gong on what he has told me.

As far as im aware it was only a small amount of mist - it was only visible due to the intense sunlight today. Im doubtful whether it is a big leak due to the fact that the system has passed 2 leak tests. I understand the garage has put some UV dye in the system to locate the leak

Unsure of any standing pressure in the system but can check.

Not too bothered about the cost since it will be the dealer who pays for it, not me. The condition is I collect the car and pay the balance on receipt of a working AC system.

[Rich D]

Originally Posted by Chris56

Hi Rich, thanks for the info.

I didn't actually take the car the the garage -it was the dealer so I am only gong on what he has told me.

As far as im aware it was only a small amount of mist - it was only visible due to the intense sunlight today. Im doubtful whether it is a big leak due to the fact that the system has passed 2 leak tests. I understand the garage has put some UV dye in the system to locate the leak

Unsure of any standing pressure in the system but can check.

Not too bothered about the cost since it will be the dealer who pays for it, not me. The condition is I collect the car and pay the balance on receipt of a working AC system.

OK cool, just be a little suspicious if they say they have "popped a new evaporater in " as on the manufacturers i listed above, it was most of a day to take the dash out, and a day to replace and rebuild it.

The UV dye is used in conjunction with a UV lamp. It makes the refrigeration oil glow under UV light, not the refrigerant. If its the evap thats leaking then they wont be able to see any residue it until its out anyway. If we suspected an evap leak, we used to pressurise with Nitrogen to 150 psi, let it stand for a few minutes, then turn on the fan with the blower on its slowest setting momentarily, closing all but one of the vents. If there was a leak, a decent electronic tester poked into the open vent should pick it up with ease.

The dealer wont of seen a refrigerant mist, hes maybe got good intentions but as i said, R134a is completely invisible in those quantities. If there was a big enough leak for an oil mist then they would hear it pissing out from behind the dash as they were charging it.

Anyway, hope you get it sorted !

[Chris56]

Thanks for the insight Rich, i will be wary if they simply change the evaporator. On the plus side I am buying the car with a 12 month warranty!

I am quite suspicious of the mist however. Particularly, as you have already said, it would have to be really p****ing out of the system to be noticed. Yet the system is holding a decent pressure and pulling a good vacuum.

I will let you know the outcome later today.

[mpg200]

I Have a 53 plate ford fusion, Dreadfull thing, Aircon needs gassing every 2 years, its rubbish. I also have an 03 plate scooby. Aircon still has the gas from the factory in it and is still icy cool. lesson... europe can't make aircon gas tight, Japan can.

[Rich D]

Originally Posted by mpg200

I Have a 53 plate ford fusion, Dreadfull thing, Aircon needs gassing every 2 years, its rubbish. I also have an 03 plate scooby. Aircon still has the gas from the factory in it and is still icy cool. lesson... europe can't make aircon gas tight, Japan can.

Assuming that you run the AC during the winter periodically to keep the compressor shaft seal lubricated.............. Probably a pinhole leak somewhere on the Ford, look for wet oily patches on the condenser ( AC front rad ) or connecting pipework/pressure switches underneath at the front. They are the favourite places exposed to the elements and stones etc.

[Chris56]

Just heard back - a leak was spotted with the UV dye where the pipes go into the evaporator. They have sourced a new part so hopefully have the car by monday.

The dealer informed me that the dash looked in a bit of a mess so I take it they are doing the job properly!

Thanks once again for your knowledge/advice

[Rich D]

Originally Posted by Chris56

Just heard back - a leak was spotted with the UV dye where the pipes go into the evaporator. They have sourced a new part so hopefully have the car by monday.

The dealer informed me that the dash looked in a bit of a mess so I take it they are doing the job properly!

Thanks once again for your knowledge/advice

Good stuff, no worries bud

[bodgit]

Originally Posted by mpg200

I Have a 53 plate ford fusion, Dreadfull thing, Aircon needs gassing every 2 years, its rubbish. I also have an 03 plate scooby. Aircon still has the gas from the factory in it and is still icy cool. lesson... europe can't make aircon gas tight, Japan can.

I disagree, my 55 cmax still blows ice cold on the origional gas. I use it every single trip, its never off.

[Chris56]

Originally Posted by bodgit

I disagree, my 55 cmax still blows ice cold on the origional gas. I use it every single trip, its never off.

Secret with any aircon system is to use it regularly throughout the year as it carries oil around the system, thus keeping the seals/joints moist and preventing them from cracking

[mark christopher]

Originally Posted by Chris56

Secret with any aircon system is to use it regularly throughout the year as it carries oil around the system, thus keeping the seals/joints moist and preventing them from cracking

best advise,e reason on fords when you select screen on vents it puts ac on, some cases without the light ;-)

[bodgit]

Originally Posted by Chris56

Secret with any aircon system is to use it regularly throughout the year as it carries oil around the system, thus keeping the seals/joints moist and preventing them from cracking

Agreed. My wife listened to her moron dad and would,nt switch hers on to save fuel. Now the gas has gone and it will set her back about £40-45 to re-gas it.