Brushless Vs brushed .. winds, rotors and settings

[RogerM]

After today I am fairly sure that my current motors could be improved on for my driving style, they are great motors but it's horses for courses like everything else in this sport.

This has got me thinking and after several conversations with Yardee, Glyn Ward and Mr Dodd ... plus several others I have decided I need to ask the audience!!!

So

What wind brushless is equivelent, in your view, to what wind brushed

How do sintered & bonded rotors compare to each other and to single / double / tripple etc. (...if that is a fair comparison to make at all)

Which do you prefer .....

1) milder motor geared to give best performance
2) hotter motor geared to give best performance
3) hotter motor calmed with gearing
4) none of the above

Also brushed or brushless for driving .... (forget about anything else other than how they fell behind the sticks)

I think I have made my choices already ...... just interested to hear what others think

[josh_smaxx]

In my opinion, taking the 19t TC class allows 10.5 Bl motors, then 9.5 would be 17t and onwards like that, as in each BL winding takes 2 brushed winds. Sintered gives better brakes and cooler temperatures, theres no doubt about that, compared to my sintered orion and my friends bonded nosram, same wind and mine stops ALOT quicker. Having only started racing recently and not really racing properly with brushed ever i cant really comment on that but i do believe that brushed is nicer to drive having used it briefly, it does seem slightly better but i cant really say that BL is bad to drive.

[racingdwarf]

I go with 2 & 3 depending on the track, I like to feal of what the car is doing, It may sound silly but I usualy have the slipper set quite tight I like the car to be a bit on the edge and I am a bit point and squrt.......get the line I want straighten up and give it the beans. Got a 9x2 in my B4 at the min for club. But the norm is 10x2. xx4 at the min I seam to go with 11x2 or 12x2

[ashleyb4]

Roger brushless is defetly diffrent to drive but its not difficult to ajust I preffer to have a steady motor that i gear right andget a good turn of speed out of .

A

[SlowOne]

I'm not a brushless fan, having tried it 12 months ago, unable to get used to the feel, and given it up. However, in my class (12th Scale) it has become impossible to keep up with brushed, so I've gone into it again

The latest breed of speedos and motors are far less intimidating. Although it's only a 6.5, the car is ballistic, and the motor is much more driveable. In 12th we don't use brakes, so the biggest thing to get used to is NOT feathering the throttle into a bend. Drag brakes only work with the throttle at neutral, so learning to come right off it, and let the car flow into the corner, is the hardest thing to do.

I go with milder motors geared to the top speed needed, and don't be frightened to adjust the timing to find a sweeter motor, too. Hot winds need too fine a throttle control for me, and what's the point in having all those horses, and no chance to use them?!! HTH

[SimonW]

In my experience with brushless (Novak GTB with 3.5 sintered) there seemed to be no low speed 'feel' if you know what i mean, it was almost like a micro switch. I tried turning my throttle down to 70% but that made no difference, tried also the throttle curve expo' that did very little too. there is a piccy on here somewhere of my car at eastrax starting to pull a wheelie 3/4 of the way up the straight. The final nail in the brushless coffin was hammered in when my GTB looked at a puddle and blew up. Gone back to brushed 10-2 checkpoint on my QC3 a skim and brushes every 2 months is good to go. I'm happy now, LoL

[super__dan]

Originally Posted by SimonW

Novak GTB with 3.5 sintered

In what class?

Originally Posted by SimonW

Gone back to brushed 10-2 checkpoint on my QC3

You know a 3.5 and a 10 turn are incomparible?

[elvo]

Originally Posted by RogerM

How do sintered & bonded rotors compare to each other and to single / double / tripple etc. (...if that is a fair comparison to make at all)

Which do you prefer .....

1) milder motor geared to give best performance
2) hotter motor geared to give best performance
3) hotter motor calmed with gearing
4) none of the above

I like lots of bottom end only to numb it by using a big pinion. Off-road is all about torque... So bonded is just not an option for me. I'm running a CS (www.cs-electronic.com) 6.5 with the thickest rotor (13.5mm) geared 23/78 x 2,6. LRP Speedo settings: 2-2-2-2, or 2-3-2-2 for more power, or 2-1-1-1 for low traction.
Haven't come across a brushless motor that has the same sensitivity and feel at low revs as a brushed, but this is very close.
I think talking about equivalents is difficult. All I know for sure is that brushless motors have much more power overall :-)

[Chris Doughty]

I don't even think about brushed motors anymore, I changed as soon as brushless was legal, I did feel small differences but nothing too big, I can't say that I have ever missed any feature of a brushed motor. either on the track or off the track.

[Alfonzo]

I run the Mamba Max 5700kv setup and love it. Very smooth, strong brakes and totally consistent. I think I'd class this setup as 'mild motor geared to give performance'. I keep flirting with the idea of one of the hotter versions, but apart from being a handful on the track (and let's face it, It's never been a lack of horsepower that's let me down, just lack of talent ) the hotter motors will take a far greater toll on transmission. These latest BL systems are capable of putting LOTS of grunt through those poor old belts and gears..

The nice thing about BL is you just plug it in and go. No skimming, no brushes, no nonsense! Leaves time to concentrate on all other aspects of car setup etc. Great for us club racers.

[SimonW]

Super Dan, I run 2wd off-road dude, an RB5 to be precise. I know there is no comparison power wise it is just low speed feel that bit where you are just feathering the throttle waiting to nail it out of the corner i never knew where i was with brushless. Kev Lee thought i was a nutter too.....

[Mike Hudson]

running a 3.5 is crazy i dont anyone who uses oneor what track you use to an advantage on, I did like brushed when i had not so long ago but the skimming and various motor problems made go to brushless and i have never gone back since, I have plenty of low and mid feel throttle and i run a Novak 5.5L in both 2wd and 4wd and so far had no problems and my laptimes have improved dramatically

[super__dan]

Simon, I'd place a 3.5 at about a 6 turn equvilent and so I'd be surprised if you could get that kind of feel with a 6 turn brushless with a 2wd buggy. Honestly I think if you tried any decent sensored speedo with a 6.6 in 2wd you'd change your mind.

[mobile chicane]

Originally Posted by super__dan

Simon, I'd place a 3.5 at about a 6 turn equvilent and so I'd be surprised if you could get that kind of feel with a 6 turn brushless with a 2wd buggy. Honestly I think if you tried any decent sensored speedo with a 6.6 in 2wd you'd change your mind.

3.5 in a 2wd bonkers



I tried 4.5 in a 2wd and put my 6.5 strqight back in