AGM rule change proposals

[Northy]

AGM is this Sunday and I've not seen any discussion about the rule change proposals..... so....

Discuss

G

[James]

Going up onto the rostrum for all finals in qualification order is a GOOD idea

[Mike Hudson]

Originally Posted by smOkin

Going up onto the rostrum for all finals in qualification order is a GOOD idea

Seconded!

[footey]

Think the 1 about the lower graded drivers always going on first is wrong as means we will always be get the track at its worst But think what james as said is good

[James]

Originally Posted by footey

Think the 1 about the lower graded drivers always going on first is wrong as means we will always be get the track at its worst

Youre actually more likely to get a 'rain assisted' round though... if it rains mid round

[Mike Hudson]

Originally Posted by footey

Think the 1 about the lower graded drivers always going on first is wrong as means we will always be get the track at its worst But think what james as said is good

Not necessarily... can agree for indoor tracks with slippy floor but outdoors is different... tracks can sometimes gradualy get worse or gradualy get better through the day.

[footey]

thats why surley it would be better if they changed the starting positions like they have been

[MALLET]

Have it that the heats change with the next round. As the do with the 1/8th Rally cross series

eg:-

Round 1
---------
Heat 1
Heat 2
Heat 3
Heat 4
Heat 5
heat 6
Heat 7
Heat 8

Round 2
---------

Heat 3
Heat 4
Heat 5
heat 6
Heat 7
Heat 8
Heat 1
Heat 2

Round 3
---------

Heat 5
Heat 6
Heat 7
heat 8
Heat 1
Heat 2
Heat 3
Heat 4

Round 4
---------

Heat 7
Heat 8
Heat 1
heat 2
Heat 3
Heat 4
Heat 5
Heat 6

This is what I mean

[James]

Effectively thats what happens now though

[MALLET]

I don't know with the 1/10th nationals as I haven't done one yet.

I was just putting it forward James sorry

[pugboy]

One thing I am a little unsure of (and I'm sure I'll get shot down) is why the electric board motor list needs to exist and perhaps a broader range of motors could be permitted. For example I have a Mambamax sensorless system in one of my cars, but cannot use it at BRCA sanctioned events with the cm36 motor. I can use another approved motor but of course at additional cost, and the choice of approved sensorless motors is somewhat limited. My point really is that providing the motor is 540 size, there can be no advantage gained almost no matter what the motor is, as out and out speed is no longer a factor given race length and battery technology.

To me anything that opens up the sport to a wider entry level will help get 1/10 to grow back to the level of interest that existed 20 years ago.

[Chrislong]

Originally Posted by smOkin

Effectively thats what happens now though

Not quite, look at Mallets list as he isn't reversing the heat order, just moving the starting point but heats still running in sequence.

Which id be in favour of, as it stops the heat 1 marshalls from marshalling heat 12 for the reversed round - as potentially its possible to have slower/less experienced/younger marshalls (no offence).

[Danny McGee]

C final to marshell 2nd leg of A

[stuartw]

Originally Posted by Danny McGee

C final to marshell 2nd leg of A

Dont recall that proposal being on the list Danny.

[Danny McGee]

Originally Posted by stuartw

Dont recall that proposal being on the list Danny.

well it should have been.............................................. ...... Aside from racing, i avoid the politics, something for others to worry about. I just want to enjoy my racing!

[IceMike]

Originally Posted by pugboy

One thing I am a little unsure of (and I'm sure I'll get shot down) is why the electric board motor list needs to exist and perhaps a broader range of motors could be permitted. For example I have a Mambamax sensorless system in one of my cars, but cannot use it at BRCA sanctioned events with the cm36 motor. I can use another approved motor but of course at additional cost, and the choice of approved sensorless motors is somewhat limited. My point really is that providing the motor is 540 size, there can be no advantage gained almost no matter what the motor is, as out and out speed is no longer a factor given race length and battery technology.

To me anything that opens up the sport to a wider entry level will help get 1/10 to grow back to the level of interest that existed 20 years ago.

this isnt as easy as u think. every manufacture has the opertunity to put forward there products to get tested to see if they fit within the standards of the sport. from there each product is tested to check to see if there safe and wotever else, then the list or aproved equiptment is compiled. some things either arent available in the numbers that are required or the manufacture hasnt tried or the product has failed the tests.

its always a good idea if your planning to do a brca event to look at the list before buying anything to check to see if its on the list. it all helps to try and keep the standards of all cars the same and give ppl equal opertunities, wouldnt be fair for someone to have a one off or anything like that which would produce extremes. the list serves to stop this. u for one appreciate all the work that goes into makin this list, as i know it takes ALOT of time, and effort.

[terry.sc]

Originally Posted by pugboy

One thing I am a little unsure of is why the electric board motor list needs to exist and perhaps a broader range of motors could be permitted.

It exists because several (not just off road!) electric classes want it.

The 1/5th bike class didn't use a list until one worlds when the 27T class was won using a seriously quick motor specially hand built for the event and unavailable to other competitors. It had 27 turns of wire, but broke every other ROAR and BRCA rule.

It's there for several reasons.
1. Touring cars and 1/12th scale run several classes based on the motor specification, so everyone runs identical motors in each class. The electric board ensures that, for example, all approved 10.5T motors are what they say they are and that they meet the rules to ensure that the 10.5 class has a range of motors that are roughly equal in performance. If the motors weren't on the EB list, who's to say that one manufacturers very fast '10.5' isn't really a 9.5 with a 10.5 label.

2. As approvals for the electric board list must be submitted by the UK distributor, it ensures all the motors on the list have someone in the UK to deal with any problems, it also guarantees the motor will be available to buy through most hobby shops in the UK.
It means if someone finds a motor that revs higher with more torque than the rest, but it's only made by hand in Romania, it can't be used as no one else can get hold of them.

3. The electric board rules includes a detailed specification of the motor, including for example the type of connector for the sensor so we can just buy replacement motors without having to buy a new ESC to go with it as they all use the same connector. It also includes can and rotor dimensions, again to ensure all motor have similar performance and that they will all fit in every car on the market. It prevents for example someone bringing out a motor 10mm shorter than the rest that has less torque but more speed, if it works then everyone would have to buy that particular motor to keep up.
If there's no one to approve the motors, everyone's motors would have to be dismantled and measured to check they comply.

BTW Regarding your cm36, even if there wasn't the EB list it would never be approved for racing. It doesn't meet the dimensions in the BRCA handbook as it isn't actually 540 size.

4. The electric board rules also mean there's a maximum price limit on the motors on the approved list. Obvious reasons here, with no approval list there's nothing to prevent manufacturers developing motors with £150-200 price tags.

If after all that you still don't think 1/10th off road needs the EB list then next year propose that the list isn't used. Any rule changes to be discussed this year had to be submitted 6 weeks ago.

BTW in case anyone hasn't seen them the proposals are here
http://www.brca.org/Sections/off_e_1...20Fnl._doc.doc

[c0sie]

Just want to say a quick thanks to PW, CF, the rest of the Committee and the lads in the room at the AGM who introduced themselves to me today.

Was nice to be able to put some names to "him off of oOple" faces, and see how the pro's do things