Losi 22 and tyres ?
 

After trying tons of stuff to get my 22 to work (HRC / LRC - squat / oils / springs / Steve-Proracing setup - Old Dogs tips etc), i've come to this final disappointing conclusion.

The car ONLY works with NEW, or almost new tyres.

I think that the club drivers out there (me included) are trying to chase the right setup from the info posted on oOple, but is just does not work unless you have new boots.

I ran a set of one meeting old tyres today on the 22, then after struggling for initial traction out of the corners (grass and astro track) I put them on my X6 - the X6 had bags of grip and was in no doubt which way should be pointing forwards. Was about a second a lap quicker with the X6. These tyres would normally last me at least another meeting...

So - i'm undecided what to do, car is good when grip is high - crap when it's low, and crap when the tyres start to go off. So annoying when another car gets close, so you boot it, only to find yourself pointing in the wrong direction !

yep know where you coming with this costing a fortune in tyres

allways been the same, 60% ability 40% budget!!

the 22 is a tyre eater thats for sure one meeting on brand new schumacher yellows on high grip astro some racers use 2 sets in one all day meeting at are track great car the 22 just not good on tyres but still the best 2wd ive ever had :thumbsup:

had a this problem yesterday on a grass track with half worn schumacher mini spikes just no rear end grip in corners other buggys cougars, x6, b4 could all power out of the corners with ease.

Yep, definitely seem to be eating through yellow minispikes a lot faster with my 22 compared to my previous X6.

Our track is high grip astro so the 22s work really well on it but the downside is tyre cost. Tyres work great for 2-3 runs and then tail off very quickly to the point that after 5-6 runs they are virtually useless.

I know a lot of serious racers would probably not consider using tyres this old anyway but it would be nice to be able to use older tyres for practice or club meetings.

I really like my 22 but the performance decline for used tyres does seem steeper than other cars.

Going to see if I can get blues to work next time.

Rob

Are there any difference in wear etc. with the DBOOTS tyres ?

I've not tried the Dboots as our summer series is running only schumacher tyres so was not really testing or practising with other makes. Not sure if anyone else has tried the Dboots - not seen anyone but I'll be looking to see if anyone is getting on with anything other than yellow minis at club meets.

Rob

Exactly my problem.
It really is making me reconsider running the 22. I'm sure the people who are getting them to go well are using new tyres much more often than club drivers. I have sets that look fine, but don't work anymore on the 22 !

It does make me wonder about the car in general - why can my X6 grip like shit to a blanket with the same set of tyres, same speedo - batteries etc ?

A pal with a standard XXX Cr was way quicker than me out of the corners this weekend, might just get mine out and run that instead...

Considering going rear motor before I sack it off - can anyone comment on grip / tyre wear with rear motor ?

2 sets of tyres a day is a bit much and as for the dboots i also used them on grass good when new as good a mini spike yellow but again as they became half wore grip droped off alot.

tempted to try the atomic carbon tardis conversion.

I ran mine rear motored wiyh dboots yesterday in the me regional and the wear was much less this way round. There is still life in mine for at least one more club meet. The grip level is much more consistent when running rear motored. had my best result so far with the 22 in rear motor config. Finished c2. Thats good for me. It lacked abit of agility infield but had lots of forward drive

When i was racing indoors the rear end grip was good for 3 weeks but terrible thereafter, particularly when accelerating out of a corner.

Im still learning the effects of changing certain setup features.

Would increasing the amount of anti-squat help matters, since this will encourage weight transfer over the rear of the car?

I've also ordered one of those stainless steel pivot blocks from Cream.

More antisquat will give more traction out of corners but take away some on power steering

Thanks Timee80, im currently running 1 deg with the rear weight kit, what should I increase it to (when i've added the 42g hinge pin block)?

yes that is what I have found, even though most people say less antisquat gives
more squat and more traction.

Tardis conversion is tempting, but £145 is a load of cash.
What if it's still as bad !
Also a question Mark over shell fitment ?

Anti squat, with the 4.0 HRC :
I ran 3degree, switched to 1 degree and it made things much worse accelerating out if corners. 3degree for me from now on.

From my findings I reckon around 10 degrees of anti squat should make the car drivable !

I like 1 degree anti.squat. I found with much more i have too little steering on power and too much off power. When i ran mid i used stock 4 hole 55 pistons and 20 wt oil. Try 3mm washers under outer rear ball stud and make sure you use the 25 degree front kickup shim.

will give that a go. Should I use the 5 of 10 deg castor blocks?

Im using 3 right now but only because 5 wasnt in stock. 5 should give more initial turn in than 10

:lol: I've generally found the car more competitive when the grip levels have been high, which I guess tallies with new tyres. Something I've also noticed is uneven tyre wear on mini spikes, I was wearing the inside edges of the fronts at Southport and only the centre of the rears. I would have thought grip and tyre wear would be better if I could use all of the spikes!

Strangely got 2 meeting out of a set of original Schumacher mini spike and just about 1 meeting out of the new mini spike 2. Same track same conditions same set staggers up front.

Im at the conclusion that the car was designed as a rear motor 1st - for the US market, then a mid motor 2nd. Mid motor is a compromised design that i'm guessing was not a widely tested on UK style tracks ?

The motor in mid config does look way too far forward, which is why we are all putting weight all over the shop - the motor should have being further back and over the wheels !

I'm going to weight mine up a bit more - put a tamer motor in it and gear it high to try to calm down the acceleration as much as possible. (Already got the slipper slipping, speedo set on lowest punch, throttle curve set etc !)

If it's still not happy unless I put new tyres on it, it will be retired or i'll put the motor out the back !

http://www.oople.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74468

Got one of these on my losi 22 and its right where the weight is needed.

I've just ordered one of these too - did you use it with the rear weight kit?

I'm using the equivalent of cream weight and this combined with a slipper brass flywheel is awesome if you move shock top to outer on tower!!
I can now make the car understeer if I want.
Oh and this is on 2 meeting old minispikes!!

I tq'd the York meeting last Saturday like this.
I couldn't get the rear of my car to break free without very aggressive throttle control.

wonder when grip is low LRC blocks will help with rear end grip.

Lrc def gives you more forward drive than hrc.

Hi guys one thing that i would say to try is to raise the gearbox by 2mm. Just like on the x6 this will give you more forward traction. I have done this to my 22 and i can now run old tyers and still have lots of traction out of the corner.:thumbsup:

how is this done?

To get it to the same as what i am running you need to do the following.
(Befor you screw it all down check the length of your screws)
1. put 2 AC shock limit washers over the rear pivot block screws that go into the gearbox.
2. do the same to the bracket in front of the motor.
3. The front pivort block i cut the screw tabs off a t3 anti-sauat insert and then put this under the normal anti-squat insert that i run.

Hope that makes sens

Just by way of an update/comparrison:

when I got the TLR22 I was racing indoor on carpet, after 3 weeks the Mini-Pins were completely useless

Over the summer I fitted the Cream rear weight

I have been back indoors for 4 weeks and my rear tyres still have plenty of grip - so much that I am still trying to dial out the understeer that I am experiencing.

As Sly said, the weight is exactly where it is needed, but also it seems to solve the tyre issue, particularly on high-grip tracks

I have just read this thread and after trying out some dBoots terrabyte tyres new and some Schmacher mini pin yellow new I found that the car was so different to when I used any worn tyre. I have been playing with weight, changing saddles round 90 degree and all sorts and the biggest difference made was new tyres. I will have to get a Cream weight to see how it reacts then when the tyres get worn.

i two have found that the 22 loves new tyres fastrax turff gripers all round when new all the grip you could wont but after 4 batteries the rear were shot ok on the astro but on very worn grass useless good job the fastrax are only £5 i did try a set of yellow mini pins but found them to have to much grip on the astro and not enuff on the grass so will be running mini spikes on my car indoor on carpet i run mini pins all round and slam the car on the deck

So then can some of you put your choice of tyres front and rear and track ie carpet/ astro / clay/ grass

On a astro/ grass track I like mini spikes all round
On a carpet indoor track I like mini pins all round

What do you lot like ?

Carpet - yellow mini pins on rear, cut staggers on front. Rear tyres are now 6 meetings old and still really grippy

Any one els won't to put there tyre set up on here also what Inserts
I run med all around but I am thinking of trying soft to see if I can get more even were as at the mo rear is middle worn only

Hi all was wondering if there is anywhere in the uk to get foam tyres for my 22 as I do a lot of indor carpet racing

If you're only wearing out the middle of your tyres it suggests you're just buzzing off/spinning the rear tires from having too much motor and being too aggressive on the throttle.

I think you would find, unless you're just racing on flat track (no jumps), that offroad style tyres with inserts will outperform foam. You might want to contact member OneKiwi as he has access to some very nice rubber slicks that might better serve your purposes.
http://www.oople.com/forums/showthre...ghlight=Slicks

Yes there is jumps but only small ones I think it could be the way I drive then as I am running a 6.5 and I am bit of a throttle jabber