UK Short Course Nationals 2011 / Short Course Shootout
 

Afternoon everyone

The web site for the UK Short Course Nationals 2011 is now live.

Please use this to enter and find venue information.

The site will be continually updated in the next few weeks

www.ukshortcourse.com

Cheers

Chris

Good news Chris :thumbsup:

£5 entry fee per round is a bargain...

very tempting to run 2 classes now :woot:

Keep'in it cheap to encourage all the new drivers to get a taste for proper racing!!

Hopefully it will encourage drivers from other classes to get an RTR and have a go just for just to experience this class.

It doesnt say in your rules, but are you allowing reverse to be used ?? Its banned in every other class which i think is a good idea.

Hi after a quick discussion, the use of reverse will not be allowed as other classes.

I will get the rules updated in the morning.

Cheers

Chris

Bit miffed. How do i tell the young one he's banned coz his RTR has reverse :mad: Thought this was series was to encourage new blood.

Hi,

i`m for having reverse please and keep the rules to a minimum,you will only exclude drivers if you start with making loads of rules IMO.

This is supposed to be a fun light hearted fun class,all about having some FUN :)
My car has reverse,i will use it to get myself out of trouble if i can,will you ban me for using it?.
The "no reverse" rule was from a time back in the dark ages,when ESC`s blew up if you used reverse,it`s a well out dated rule and should be dropped from all classes IMHO [just to throw that in there :D ] LOL

OK with me if you [anyone]want to keep it in other classes,but to me this is one reason why those classes get limited uptake,just too many rules and red tape,forcing people to conform.

:p
:p
:p

S.

Hi Richard

Your young'n isn't banned at all!! Far from it.

It's not a rule/situation we had considered initially, as we are used to not having reverse.

Personnaly I think it confuses marshalls as you don't know which truck has reverse and which doesn't.

Maybe (Stefs idea) we but an R on the top of trucks with reverse enabled. Or maybe we run Reverse trucks together??

Don't forget this is a new class and new series so we are all learning to a point.


Agree with the rules Twisty, the less the better, this series is about fun.

Cheers

Chris

Disagree with you on that, the reverse rule is used to stop you reversing into somebody else and ruining there race, and with delayed reverses the driver doesnt even know when it will kick in so how are fellow racers.

Hi,

yes i have heard the arguments for and against plenty over the years.
These trucks are tough and have big bumpers,you can save the marshall the run more often than not,meaning a more relaxed marshal,more relaxed meeting.

No one wants to reverse into another car and take them out,thats is not in the spirit of racing and shouldn`t even need mentioning.

I like reverse,it helps much more than it hinders,cars should have reverse IMHO.

:cry: if you decide to bring this rule to the series.

S.

Hi,

sorry,but this is bugging me.
If you implement a "no reverse" rule,i will Boycot the use of brakes and lock my brakes out :thumbsup: is that OK?

cheers,
S.

PS,I`m a trouble maker,sorry :woot:

Do what you want with your brakes, if you consistently run into the back of people, you run the risk of being removed from the meeting :thumbdown:

Is it not possible to lock reverse out on the basic RTR speed controllers in question?

i'm pretty sure that most RTR SCT's have option of forward/brake as a seperate function to forward/reverse on the speedo, none of our racers run reverse and there are a fair few out of the box RTR's

I strongly agree with the organisers and Graveltrap's last comment...

In R/C racing reverse is not allowed, simple!... only class i know of is Mardaves and after seeing some of their national racing recently, all that ever happens is cars reverse out of barriers very slowly into path of oncoming cars... crash!

this not acceptable and will only cause arguments when a truck going along with flow of circuit direction gets broken because of a car reversing in front of them.

I agree that marshals will make a split second decision and head for a car that looks to be stuck facing markings etc.. not good if suddenly the stranded car backs up and leaves a marshal heading across track for no reason.

If its a major issue and enough drivers feel they need reverse... run a Novice class for cars running reverse and they can drive which way they want without upsetting the racers used to forward only.

Would like to know the basis of the 'banned in every other class' statement?

Have just trawled the BRCA 1:10 electric off-road rules (here: http://www.brca.org/sites/default/fi...off%20road.pdf) and it clearly states:

23. CONSTRUCTION RULES - GENERAL

23.5 Any type of speed controller may be used but it must be contained within the car and not protrude through the body shell

Am with many of the others that banning them WILL put people of from entering this series as many of the RTR chassis come with Forward/Reverse ESC's and yes I do understand the implications of reversing into traffic and that marshalls may get slightly 'miffed' and going for a truck that has reverse capability but thought that this series was aimed at ALL drivers of ALL abilities with very few rules/regs to promote participation:thumbsup: and not select rules that will put drivers off.:thumbdown:

We are not running to BRCA 1/10th off-road rules... they are for buggies and stadium trucks... there are no rules governed for SCT's.

The majority will not be running reverse, it won't be fair to have a vote on it during the first round briefing as reverse fans will easily be out voted.

I've never seen it be an issue before!

The BRCA rules also state it is an offence to drive the wrong way on a track... whch reversing is technically breaking that rule.

Reverse could also be seen as an unfair advantage to those having to wait for marshals

Seperate classes... it makes it easier on marshalling and fairer to other drivers.

What micro's did when it all started was allow the speedo's but ban the use of reverse. That seems a perfectly reasonable compromise, meaning everyone gets to race, nobody has to buy new gear and racers can race without it becoming a dodgem track.

Just ban the USE of reverse, not the speedo.

Hmm.

I was joking about the brakes,but this is getting a tad silly.If i have to be in a "Novice" class because i would like to use reverse and/or have to have a big "R" on the roof of my car,i`m sorry,but `i`m out,you will have us wearing pointy "D" hats and standing in a corner next.

If you are stuck somewhere reverse or not,a marshall will be on the way,if you want to run forward/brakes only,thats up to you.I can`t see why we need any rule at all or to segregate again,just pants.

Was really looking forward to this,but it isn`t looking so good at the moment.I almost fell over my bottom lip too.
:cry:


S

Just checked...

SC10, XXX SCT, Strike, Blitz, Slash, Slash 4x4 all have OPTIONAL reverse, meaning they can be reprogrammed to run as forward/brake only

Pretty sure majority of RTR speedos are the same these days

There should be no extra expense expected for new racers, RTR's can be competitive in this class with experience and we want a friendly fun championship for everybody, but keeping to basic R/C racing rules is the only way you will keep the experienced racers interested as well as giving new starters a welcome start into the hobby.

Its not good for either party if a reversing car gets smacked by another one at speed, both parties lose out.

Quite simple matey, don't crash and you won't need reverse... thats the aim of the game :thumbsup:

Its R/C racing basics... at some point in the hobby you won't be able to use reverse, better for the new starters to get used to it in an entry class than than trying it at another big meeting and gettng penalised.

Its racing, its a championship... its not bashing with mates in a field where anything goes, there needs to be basic rules and format or it won't work

Ok guys we are going to go round in circles with this one...

From a seasoned race directors perspective you CANNOT run trucks with reverse and trucks without reverse in the same heat.

It confused drivers and marshals alike, and will lead to unfair incidents. I seen it all before.

Just because you run RTR doesn't mean you want or have to run reverse.

This is not about "banning" or penalising novice drivers especially RTR trucks. I'm even sure there are many drivers using non RTR kit who would like to use reverse.

it's just about a setting on the ESC and driver/track etiquette and marshal safety.

Well ,there seems to be no point arguing any further,but a last stab.

As a driver i don`t drive into cars that are reversing out unless i`m very unlucky,i use my eyes,fortunately they seem to work OK.

As a marshall,i`ll start to move towards a vehicle in trouble,if it reverses out and gets going again,i return to my marshal point.

SERIOUS NOTE.
Please keep us informed on this and any other decisions made as soon as you can.

thanks.

S.

Reverse is for Girls! :woot:

Another quick question - was hoping for my daughters to make their SCT debuts at the EPR round. Neither are BRCA members - would this be compulsory for them to race at this meeting as it's their first event?

Hi Hog

My understanding is that you can race at a BRCA affiliated club up to three times before you have to join.

Based on that they will be fine.

Cheers

Chris

The no reversing rule has very fundamental reasons, it stops a marshal picking up a truck/buggy just as it's about to set off and potentially do damage to fingers etc. With the high torque that 550 motors can deliver I can see the potential is even greater in this class for serious damage.


A question, if reverse is allowed does this mean that the club running the event will lose their BRCA insurance coverage and leave themselves open to private litigation if someone is injured.

rubbish I and many used reverse at last years meeting. No problems. Sc is for fun don't make it anal and reliant on rules.

No the brca will not pull any insurance as a non brca sanctioned event you only need to comply to general rules. You do not need to use the eb list for lipo or motors either. and as there is no rule banning reverse its a pointless question

Taking reverse out will stop me entering....

Why do you need to use reverse ?? You have been in this sport long enough to know how to go forward, left and right ?? I dont understand what all the fuss is ??

So here's a SERIOUS question... and it is only a question at the moment

Are the drivers that want to use reverse beginner/novice drivers?

I can`t speak for others,but i`m not a beginner or novice,i have nearly 20 years of RC racing experiance under my belt and do more than my fair share to help out.
As Mark points out,there were no problems at last years shootout with racers using reverse,i also used reverse as did nearly everyone else.

Marshals are not confused by reverse,nor are they in any more danger because cars reverse.

I got enough of this type of nonsence last year though,when the Slash trucks were excluded because they were deemed uncompetative by the new elite short course racers.That decision was made on the day and even though i benefitted by winning the Slash class,i would of rather raced against everyone else.

This is turning into another farce,please don`t let that happen.

BR,
S.

Not sure why this has got under people's skin so much, let people run reverse if they want - it can't hurt :)

I don't use reverse personally, but I think everyone should run the same to be fair, but hey, that's just my opinion...

its only a becoming a farce because of people whinging about using reverse... :thumbdown:

Organisers have already said no reverse... I agree and support decision... as will the majority.

since the speedos are all programmable to disable it, there isno problem with cost... so what is the issue?

The aim of racing is to go around a track in its set direction as fast as possible, faster than everyone else to win... not to crash or doing 3 point turns, practise more, then you won't crash.

Marshals are there to get cars going again if they crash, simples! I you crash you wait to be marshalled like everyone else will have to.

people threatening not to support a championship because they can't go backwards is pathetic...

I've raced for 20 years+ and its never been an issue i've seen before.

put your teddys back in the prams and get on with it like everyone else is prepared to do! :woot:

Since its a fun championship... anyone wishing to use reverse... has to drive backwards around the track.. seems fair to me!

double post

Reverse suggestion
 

Can I suggest the following:

Using reverse may be an advantage in that the driver can recover from a situation quicker than a marshall can recover the car.

Please feel free to comment as appropriate :confused:

Quite a few newbies at one of the clubs are drive at start with SC's and then progress to buggies. They get a shock when they race that class to find that reversing is penalised. Why not start them on the right track to start with and ban reverse. Anyway' reversing is for the wussies.

It could be seen as an advantage... but driving backwards is not progressive to lap times!

since i'm not planning on crashing it shouldn't effect anything...

got a big bumper on the front of truck if anything backing across track gets in the way! :thumbsup:

can't be *rsed in arguing over racing basics, let them have reverse, will only end in tears, broken cars and lazy marshalling excuses. :thumbdown:

as long as plenty of folks turn up and have a laugh... who cares!

yes your right, i have been in this sport long enought to know reverse is not banned in 10th off road or on road!
but this class allows contact and somone can tap you into the hose, i want to be able to recover my self instead of the marshall running for my car that has not had an accident, but been stopped by a legal fun move.....

i dont see what the fuss is about with those against it, if you dont want it, dont use it, if you do then it should be allowed

what i would like to ask why the organizers have decided to ban reverse?

just spoke to PW (10th ic chairman) and in 10th off road at BRCA and EFRA there is no ban on reverse!


also spoke to GD (Chief scruiteneer of 10th electric on road) and they have NO rule banning reverse!

so please explain why it needs banning in this class?

Quick change of subject as the reverse thing has drawn out long enough...

Would you be interested in having a crossover jump style feature to spice things up and emphasise the fun a bit?

Seen a few American tracks running them and they look fun, don't see an issue with safety as long as visibility from rostrum is good and marshals are out of the firing line... being able to jump over cars going around another track section would be fun?

how long have you been in this sport to know rules then?


your above claim is totally and fully incorrect........ its allowed in 10th off road in BRCA and EFRA and its allowed in BRCA 10th touring!