Disabled access
 

Hi all,

Just a question i am 43 years old and have been racing since the age of 18, but for the last 4 years i have been in a wheelchair and you guessed it still want to race, but the trouble i have is no clubs have any kind of access to the rostrum at all for anyone in a wheelchair.

Now i understand this but feel that really more could be done for people in wheelchairs Lewis Hamiltion the F1 racer his brother races in nitro 1/18th and he is disabled but again he struggles onto the rostrum you would have thought that we would have some kind of help. I have approached lots of clubs by e-mail one mailed me back the others well they just ignored me i am not going to name any clubs but if they read this they would know.

I am not asking for a miracle or you would have thought i am, all i am asking for is a little understanding and maybe some access to allow me to carry on with the sport i love so much.

What part of the country are you at?

There are a couple of clubs up in the North West that have chair access, one 8th and one 10th.

Hi sorry, i am in wiltshire west country

I mentioned wheelchair access to John @ Ardent and within a month, he had a ramp built.

I think part of the issue is, there aren't many racers who are also wheelchair users, but if you're a wheelchair user, and see the rostrum, and see no access to it, what can you do, and will a lot just not bother mentioning anything?

If this was a big business, then you should be able to expect full access, but since it isn't, all I can suggest is approaching individual clubs (as you've done already), but also following up, and looking into some kind of funding for those clubs to make the adaptions needed.

I was going to mention Ardent Raceway as i noticed the ramp access rostrum yesterday, a great facility if you like indoor carpet racing.

I run a club for 1/8th nitro and 1/10th electric offroad and was approached by a couple of guys last year needing wheelchair facilities to come and race, as a club we just could not afford to improve the outdoor venue safely so approached local council and Lottery funding for help, were turned down flat for any funding to help improve access :mad:

We are building a second rostrum for another integrated track so are trying to design in a raised platform which has ramped access and is high enough to give good visibility.

if i see any other clubs that cater for wheelchair users then i'll let you know :thumbsup:

moto arena
 

When i visited Moto arena, there was a guy in a wheelchair using the second floor (accessible by lift), as he couldnt use the rostrum.
Seemed to give a good view of the track, and i think the rest of the facilities looked wheelchair friendly.

some clubs dont have a rostrum big enough for a wheel chair like at don valley also wombwell near me.if more clubs offered wheel chair access there would be more people able to race.best thing you can do is speak to they guys who run the club about racing there and see if its possible for something to be done for you.the only problem is the cost of doing it but there are companies out there who made ramps with abit of blagging will sort a ramp at cost or even free if you go in with a camera and pretend your filming for tv.

I'm in the process of designing a new build metal restrom for a new venue in North East Hampshire, one side will be a ramp, the other steps.

If think in time good old Health and Safety and peoples human rights will come into play soon enough.

you have to remember that it has to come out of the clubs pocket which most clubs are none profit so all there money goes on booking venues and new bits for the tracks when needed.i would try the melinda messenger method and blag a ramp free from somwhere

Prefer to try Melinda Messenger full stop :woot::woot::woot::woot:

If anyone one knows of support available for clubs or if any r/c clubs have had help from any associations recently then please let us know,

We would happily provide the facilities but with limited funding its not possible, especially when health and safety of drivers/visitors has to be priority,

our local authorities and Lottery application were refused as we were technically a private membership driven club and governed by BRCA, told it would be down to BRCA to support their disabled members, which i would be surprised if that was possible due to number of clubs and venues associated.

Hi Neil,

It's very good that you have come forward and asked for help on this.
Our sport/hobby crosses all kinds of borders, physical, age, race, gender, just to name a few and when racing there is no advantage, we all can buy the same kit, and have the same opportunity, if you can get on the rostrum.
At the EIR race this year there was a guy in a wheelchair and they had to carry him up and down for every run!
As out sport is moving forward I'm sure more and more clubs will provide wheelchair access, but we do need people like you asking the question, not having a go! So good job there mate :thumbsup:

i suppose if you struggle to get funding you can allways do a charity event yourselfs to fund something like this.people tend to do well holding events and most club members will be willing to donate a few quid maybe more and participate too to help raise the funds.
id have a scout on google for uk companies who make similar products and get in touch with them.

Our indoor club has managed to blag a metal ramp to give one of our members who's in a wheechair acces to a rostrum. We have some rostrum boxes built that are bigger footprint than the other to better accomodate wheelchairs.

It's only a low rostrum, as our room isn't massive, and we were just lucky that another member knew where he could lay his hands on a ramp that is perfect for the job. If he hadn't we'd still be lifted him up onto the rostrum to race! That worked ok for a bit, but is certainly not the safest way to go about it for him or for anyone helping to lift him.

If we hadn't been gifted our ramp it would have been a considerable spend to provide one, so it would have taken a while to get it sorted. I think all cubs would love to be able to provide that access if they knew it was going to be used by someone, but funds are obvously tight everywhere, so it's just not as easy as we'd like it to be.

We're hoping to build a new outdoor track shortly, and for sure we'll do everything we can to try and accomodate our members needs if it's feasibly possible. It just isn't always that simple when you have limited resources.

Fingers crossed we'll come up with a solution we can afford, and other clubs find ways to help out with this where they can, I'm sure if asked they'd all try and do everthing they could to help out.

Neil, where abouts in Wiltshire are you? You say south west, we have guys who come over from all around the SW area, including one from around Swindon somewhere I think to race with us, so not sure if we might be close enough?

Take a look and see...

www.caldicotrcracers.co.uk

:thumbsup:

Hi all,

Thank you for the time to read and reply, I have approached clubs and even offerd to either help pay, or even pay for a ramp, or some kind of lift contraption.

All was ignored the BRCA only affiliate clubs and therefore am unable to step in and help, i am sure one day that i may be able to race again soon, also someone mentioned Ardent i have raced my Mardave there and loved every minute of it so a big thanks goes to John at Ardent racing.

Again thank you all for the replys, PS if Melinda could supply a ramp i would be mor than happy :wub

I was watching Midlands Today earlier, and it said that the council's in this area are sitting on £70million worth of funds to go to "community projects". Say Tesco want to build a new supermarket, as a sweetener, they give so much money to pay for these things. I'm sure it's not just the midlands this happens in, but it might be worth applying for some of that money, also, if it can be organised through the BRCA, ordering more than just one off items, we could get any costs reduced.

Other than that, there are charities that could help, but it would be upto the person needing the help with the co-operation of the club concerned, so in Sam's case (my ex), we'd ask Scope (Cerebral Palsey charity), and then organisations like the Lions, the Rotary club etc.

When you say you have approached clubs, have you actually visited and spoke to the people who run it? You may find that details like e-mail addresses are no longer being used, web sites not updated etc. Most clubs rely upon members with specific skills to help organise such things, and unfortunately members move on for whatever reason, and these things lapse. So to go there is a sure fire way of ensuring they know you would like to race there, and that you would like to find a way of making it possible / wheelchair friendly.

I'm sure if you visit your local club, see what facilities they do or don't have, make sure it's somewhere you actually want to go and race, then propose what would be needed, most clubs, individuals and committee's would see what could be done.

It sounds like you're giving up on a hobby you have previously enjoyed and would like to continue enjoying... I'm sure you could make this happen if you want it to. That's my thoughts and suggestion anyway.... :thumbsup:

it's something we all need to think about, as we're all getting older.

John from Ardent here, we have the privilege of being permanent, so a breeze block solid ramp structure was fairly easy to throw together, I sympathise with both wheel chair users and RC clubs as they will desperately want to accommodate you but sometimes factors get in the way, not just money, but permission, health and safety etc.. I do think that clubs that host BRCA (and other large events) should provide access and those clubs when looking for indoor venues to run from should look for buildings that have stages as rostrums and will therefore most likely have wheelchair access. There are charities that can help fund the improvement of facilities, we ourselves are looking at building a toilet block that has disabled access (this is currently a big problem and is very much playing on all our minds at Ardent). Watch this space and i'll let you know how we get on with it all. It would be useful for the BRCA to collate and report whether clubs have wheelchair access onto rostrums, just a thought. In the meantime good luck with your racing and hope we see you back soon.

When you look about how to do it John, any "official" advice will probably only tell you how to put it together for the "standard" wheelchair user, and there's no such thing. Have a word with your local shopmobility people, and they should be able to give you a good idea, as they'll know lots of wheelchair users.

As cold as those toilet seats in the toilet block get though, the idea of pre-warmed seats is just wrong :thumbdown::lol:

Again thank you all for your replys, John i must admit the toilets were a bit naff and bloody cold but at least you have a rostrum so thank you. Yes i have been to clubs and offered to pay but i am afraid that they were un-interested so i guess maybe its time to hang up my racing shoes, anyone wanna buy a 1/8th rally cross xray sorry, and a mardave:(

Going back a lot of years, we had a racer in a wheelchair and he went to extraordinary lengths to get a rostrum-level view of the track. However, one venue put on a small lift, probably something like a fork-truck, but with a platform and a rail round it.

Perhaps instead of the usual ramped affair, we could find something like this and hire it for big events, or the club might buy one. It takes up the space of one rostrum spot, and because it is a vertical lift, it comes to ground level for the driver to get the wheelchair on and off.

Just a thought...

The only issue with a lift, is that lifts can break down. I remember me and Sam went to a club in Birmingham a few years ago during the day for a market they'd put on, and on the top floor they had a demo on. The club in question has two lifts, well, both of them broke down while Sam was 2 floors up. If he'd have been in his manual wheelchair, then no problem, he'd have had to come down the stairs on his bum while someone brought his chair down, but he was in his powerchair, which isn't the lightest thing thing in the world. He did however get a small army of helpers lifting him and the chair down 2 flights (I can't remember what I was doing at the time, possibly trying to find someone to help).

Nooooooo don't do it!!!! I see a small problem, your not a 1/10 off road racer!!!
I personally have found the 1/10 off road scene to be the nicest and most helpful racers ever. Don't sell all your stuff, don't give up, keep racing:thumbsup:

I too am a disabled driver and need to use a wheelchair.
I have raced 1/10th at a number of tracks around the UK and as yet have not found one with access to the rostrum, so I am having to use my sticks to climb the stairs. This infact makes my day a lot more physically and mentally challenging. Not been to ardent yet but nice to see a venue that has the forsight to include a ramp.:thumbsup:

I appreciate that many clubs will not neccessarily have the space in order to install a ramp nor the funds to buy or build one especially if it will only be used by the odd visitor. But as a hobby that is open to all, and covers drivers up to both national and international levels should it really be down to the disabled person to do all the pushing and drive to have access?

Just think how much more we as members and the BRCA as a group could open this up to others who are currently missing out on the sport.

The thing is i am fully in the chair no ifs no butts i am unable to walk up or down stairs at all, been like this for 4 years now my life changed overnight but hey life goes on.

Anyway reading Radio Control Car Racer the Feb 2011 edition there is an article in there from a race meeting where the rostrum was not big enough for this race meeting so they made an extension, again i undersdtand but surely if some clubs can make an extension they could make a lift? or even a two step ramp that everyone could use not just people in chairs, this then does away with the need for stairs slippery at most times etc.

if your ever up north near Blackpool and want to race, please visit this club its got a ramp rostrum, disabled loos and lots on pit space... only roblem is getting up to theclub as its up sum stair but if you cotact Damo or Danny the main guys at the club they will be more than happy to help you get up the stairs and carry ur kit etc....... check pics on web site hope this helps....... http://www.brccc.co.uk/

Hi Cr1tch

Thanks for your reply but again, as i am fully in the chair getting to the venue is via stairs so again that would present a problem for me, apart from that the club seems ideal, but thank you all for your replys it means a lot, cheers again

Neil

MKRCTC has disabled access at Millmead Hall.
Moto-Arena has disabled access as well.

One thing you may want to bear in mind is that the clubs themselves are wary of health and safety.

As the club is not a PLC, the committee members themselves are liable for anything which goes wrong.

All the while there is no wheelchair access, it's not a problem, but if you TRY to provide wheelchair access, then it has to be right. Just sticking a ramp up isn't the answer, there are rules about width, steepness, materials, traction... and I can't imagine the fallout that would happen, if a lift, which in most cases would need to be temporary, were to go wrong and injure anyone.

All club officials are volunteers, the clubs themselves are non-profit making organisations, in some cases loss making. Most will not have the legal expertise to navigate this kind of issue, and cannot afford the legal advice necessary.
Providing disabled access opens up a whole legal can of worms, which I imagine, most would rather avoid.

Surely this is something the BRCA should be able to help with and also get behind. They could also get a clubs with wheelchair access on their site so you could at least check it out from there.

Disability Discrimination Act 1995, amended 2005
 

Three of the new amendments to the DDA 1995, amended 2005

Amend the way that the DDA 1995 applies to group insurance to clarify the responsibilities of those concerned with its provisions.

Introduce for Part 3 of the DDA 1995 (i.e. access to goods and services, public authorities, private clubs and premises) a Questions Procedure similar to that, which already exists in Part 2 (i.e. employment and occupation).

Make it unlawful for private clubs with 25 or more members to treat disabled people less favourably


(with DDA 1995 however comes the phrase "reasonably practicable")


Another interesting one is the Social Model of Disability, whereby it's societies barriers that dis-ables the person and not the persons disability (that causes the barriers).

here we go human rights blah blah blah, while i fully feel for those less fortunate to be able bodied, to force clubs to cater for them could see many disapear. to fit a lift is brilliant in an ideal world, but how much? it would need power, and a saftey certificate, some one to maintain and operate it.
how many clubs have tempory rostrums?, as suggested a pallet and folk lift, no who has a licence for it and is covered to lift somone up on it?? try a risk assesment on that ( yup more H&S crap)

you could build a ramp to the rostrum for all to use but you would need a far less steeper angle of stairs to the rostrum level, or a double flight, then the slope if too steep is a slip hazard.

here a sugestion, two scafold planks each side of the steps, leaving steps in the middle and a 4x4 12 volt winch to pull chair up and down?

class lol
cater for em but they carnt get in!

You have a way with words Mark. Reading your comments has made me smile:D

The two words that are inherently linked to the DDA and HASAW are reasonably practicable as mentioned in the post:

What is reasonable for my business?

You should consider the following when deciding what sort of change is likely to be reasonable for your company:

• Type of business
• Size of the business and annual turnover
• Cost of the adjustment
• Disruption to the business while the work is being carried out
• Practicality of carrying out the adjustment
• Potential benefits to disabled customers and employees

i try :thumbsup:

brooklands is the only on road track i know off with wheel chair access. though its a platform half the height of the main rostrum.................... mind least its half way there :lol:

what the F does that have to do with the real world and model car racing/clubs :confused:..... note clubs (guys playing with toy cars) not comercial venue

Simples, the DDA does cover rc clubs if there's 25 members.

As for being reasonably practicable, that covers the implementation of the DDA, so yes, it is applicable, (Whether it's guys playing with toy cars or a load of nan's knitting).


The 'private club' provisions of the Disability Discrimination Act apply to any association of people, if:

• it has 25 or more members
• it does not matter whether the club's activities are carried out for profit, nor whether the club is corporate or unincorporated.