Newbie needs help and advice :)
 

Hi there, returning to RC cars after an extremely long break, last car I had was a Tamiya super sabre, and before that a Tamiya Super champ, just to give you some idea of how behind in the times I am :)

My daughter is now coming up to 4 years old, and is showing alot of interest in building things, messing with eletrics/electronics etc, and also in rc cars, so figured why not buy her a car kit for christmas we can build together! perfect, as I love building things as well.

We watched a few videos on youtube and straight away she was "and we can race together like that" so, car for me as well I guess.

Now I live just outside Stratford upon Avon, and apparantly there is a fairly new track open at Longmarston airfield, its an offroad coarse, and from what I can gather runs at least 2wd and 4wd off-road stuff (though I do need to get down there when theyre racing and find out for sure).

So for my daughter I figured a Mad Bull would suit her about perfect, strong and fun.

But for me, I would like something I can also mess about with her with, but also have a go at racing.

Here is where it gets difficult, definately want a kit, not a rtr car (though the rtr seem ALOT cheaper for some reason?) and I am slowly going loopy trying to decide what to get.

I'm on a limeted budget, so to be honest would like to go the cheapest route possible, not to concerned with being winner every race, but also dont want to stand no chance at all.

So I have kind of whittled it down a bit, thinking maybe a DF-03 Dark Impact, or at a push the DB-01 Durga, but thats really pushing my budget as I would need ESC as well.

Then there is the 2wd Tamiyas, DT-02 Desert Gator, and the Schumaker Cougar SVm but again thats pushing maybe a touch high on budget as it needs lipo batterys, and wanted to share charger with daughters car instead of having seperate ones, plus the ESC and motor.

Also the Associated B4, this model really confuses me, as the rtr ones, the 4.1 is it? is quite a good deal, with everything included, but I REALLY want to build it myself, and the kit is a lesser model, and will work out about the same price?

OK thats a very long post, sorry about that, but my head is really hurting after 4 days of internet research, and really need some advice from people who know what they are on about.

Many thanks in advance for any help, much appreciated.

Hi and welcome to the forum I am afraid there is know easy answer to your problem. I would suggest a great 2WD buggy to get you going is a Annsman Madrat it comes as a kit for you to build for £50.00 plus radio, batteries etc. or as a RTR kit with everything bar battery for £120.00. I would go for the kit I have one and run it at the local club, its more of a race buggy rather than a toy for your 4 year old for her I would get a toy RC and see how she gets on with it. I have been in this game over 30 years and owned a rc shop for 12 years so I do have some experience. Have fun. Ashley

Thanks alot for the reply, guess it might be better if I put a budget.

After buying daughters car (Tamiya mad bull) and everything including charger I will have maybe £250 left to spend on my car.

So would need the car, electrics, battery.

The obvious choice looking is the b4.1 for around £200 with everything, but I really want to build it with my daughter, so a rtr isnt very appealing.

Whats the differences between the rtr versions and the kit version?

Are the Tamiya df-03 and DB-01 not really up to the job?

And what are the Tamiya DT-02 cars like?

Did look at the mad rat, but seemed quite cheap, which was a little off putting, figured I could get something a bit better, though as with everything more money doesnt always mean better.

I'll take another look at the mad rat, see what I can find out.

I would strongly advise going along to your local club and talking to some of the racers.

Threads like this normaly follow with lots of confusing and probably conflicting advice - you should go to your local club and talk to the guys there, if you are going to race you would be best trying to get some kit like they have.

Rather than the Madrat, how about an X-Pro. Its the same car, but with the higher end bits and JE Spares are virtually giving them away at just £80.

The B4.1 RTR isn't really 'better' than the kit B4, since there are a few cost cuts.

Take a look into the Annsman and Associated section on here...that will give you loads of info about the Madrat / Xpro and B4.

Both are solid enough...the Madrat has been around for a year or so and has a racing version (Xpro)...which has a few upgraded parts on I think and JE Spares are selling them cheap at £80 right now...only a couple left at that price.

The B4 has a much longer history, better parts availability and much more support as most people seem to have run one at one time or another, and every club has them running round! Might stretch your budget slightly, but is a race winning car that will scale with your ability and practice!

Maybe start out with a cheap sensorless brushless system to begin with...the EZrun systems for example are amazing value, and would be fine to begin with.

Lipo batteries are a must...1 pack will do you for club racing, and they last loads better than NiMH's both in terms of run time and overall cycles.

You'll soon remember what this game is like...once the bug bites you'll be able to keep spending...funds allowing...but you can start simple!

Enjoy!

And what Stu said!!! Best advise so far!!! And do it BEFORE you spend your money! :D

Stu's giving the right advice, get along to a club - not to sure that 'longmarston' race as we know it, I could be wrong. http://www.longmarstonairfield.com/S...RadioCars.aspx

Buggys are raced at Coventry (regular/popular club), the Moto-Arena at Silverstone may be worth your while checking, new venue, still getting act together. Also the Silverstone Buggy Club (don't confuse the two),
otherwise you may have to travel west.

http://cmcc.sports.officelive.com/default.aspx


http://www.moto-arena.co.uk/


http://www.silverstonercmcc.co.uk/



Any other tracks near Stratford upon Avon ?

Thanks alot for the info guys, just what I was looking for.

Fully aim to pop to the local club this Sunday when they race and see whats going on.

Shame the Tamiyas dont seem to get much of a look in from my research, would like to go Tamiya route if possible, but not looking likely.

Thats really interesting about the B4.1, I assumed it was an upgraded B4, not a lower end B4?

Thanks alot for the advice thus far :)

Ah no, Long marston airfield has ALOT of stuff going on, big old place, the club I was refering to is this one http://www.stratfordrcmotorsport.co.uk/

http://www.stratfordrcmotorsport.co.uk/

http://www.longmarstonairfield.com/E...d-22ebc6f65f8e



not seen that one before, worth a visit first tho, see they run nitro, may be hard work for 10th electric. Just noticed the Stadium Truck picture, may be a good replacement for the madbull, seen these bounce around and look strong.

Must say that X Pro that JE Spares have on offer seems a really good deal.

Mighty tempted to grab that.

do it! :lol:

but id spend my money on the b4 kit

http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFun...n&ItemID=14046

with £35 off!!!

and if your feeling giddy with the plastic get this ....

http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFun...n&ItemID=37030

i looooove my b4!

The more expensive kit is way out of my budget after buying all the associated bits, but the first one is spot on.

Would there combo deal be worth buying? as thats pretty much exactly my budget, or would a different motor/battery etc be better?

Would this be a better buy than the X pro?

Just wanted to add that everyone is incredibly friendly and helpfull on this forum having been browsing for a few hours.

Is this the same in the spot in general? or just this community? as I am also a kean fisherman, and that community can be a little secret squirel with information :P

May I throw a different perspective on this for you!

Wanting to get back into racing and have something to do with your daughter. You need to get down to the clubs where you intend to race and see what they use.
As you are on a budget, why not ask around those clubs and on oople for preowned equipment. You can then see roughly what it should look like, take it to bits, then rebuild as per manual. That way you may get a far better standard of car for your money, buy new shells, your daughter will love her own design and if she loses interest you will not lose too much on resale.
Also if you both get addicted, like the rest of us you can then consider what is new on the scene at that time.
Maybe buy the same type of car to reduce the amount and cost of spares.
The 4wd Durgas seem a good fairly competitive starter. Many owners look to upgrade to the TRF501 or 511, once hooked and saved up!

4ndy

I agree, I origionally started out thinking of getting a nitro car for bashing, but was shown the light from a helpful fella on here called SI, i now have a b4.1 to start out on a budget to race at local clubs, i enjoyed it so much ive spent almost £500 upgrading every single part on it :lol: but its paying off as im getting better and better and coming 2nd in most of my rounds on wednesday and 2nd in the final!

its to addictive.

get the b4 buddy, its a brilliant buggy to start with, but I also agree with a 2nd hand system, get the manual, strip it down and rebuild it! its a great learing experianc. b4 take a while to get dialed in but after last night i think im almost there. its a very competative buggy.

i was in the same boat as you almost 8 months ago, but after some great help and visiting the local club its only fair I pass on what i have learnt.

Great advice, and it is something I had considered, but I think I will possibly buy a really hot racer already built second hand.

Also we will be purchasing two cars, for my daughter I was pretty much dead set on getting her a Tamiya Mad Bull, but thinking about it now thinking of getting her a Mad Rat seeing as they seem such a good car for the money from research and advice here.

Shame though because I really have a love for Tamiya from when I was a kid.

i would get yuorself the b4, or b4.1 ready to run to keep costs down....until you get addicted and start upgrading!

then i would get your daughter a mad rat kit thats only £45 on model sport.

that way you both running 2wd buggys and she will think that its as expenive as yours!

now about this, buy a b4.1 or mad rat brushless or both, and totally strip them apart, that way you have the challenge of rebuilding them, and they will include the building manuals. that way you will only need a set of lipos and charger. simples!

Thats not a bad idea, I need to look into these lipos etc, one of the benefits of buying some kits they come with ESC, motor etc, just add servo and batterys, need to do some research on all this stuff next.

First stop I guess is the club and make sure they run 2wd off road, but I'm pretty sure they will :)

Why not an Ansmann Macnum 2WD 1/10 RTR Electric Truck and a Madrat, both on lipo's & Brushless. Look for 2.4 transmitters, sticks or wheel, how's the learning curve going, not secret squirrel, too much information !! :lol::lol::lol:

I think the top guys have secret squirrel thumbs :woot: madrats & secret squirrels :wub:wub

Well I'm thinking brushless might be a tad fast for the little one, would the 540 type 23T motor that the mad rat comes with be OK with a lipo running it?

Then I'll have to research a battery/motor combo for mine.

Basicaly looking at running both cars with the same charger at least to start with, keep the little ones car a touch slow and mine a bit faster :)

By the looks of it though going to go with the mad rat and B4 stealth buggy.

Seems a good compromise between cost and performance, plus the little ones been watching videos of the mad rat and really likes the green one :D

Ah seems you need an expensive ESC for lipo batterys? or is it just the brushless needs expensive ESC?

And no, no secret squirel here :D

Lipo's just a battery, there is a BRCA approved list, need to obey a few lipo rules and you will have no problems, and you can manage on one battery each & the same charger, so Lipo with any motor/esc. (if the lipo's drop below approx 6.3volts or something its not good for them & may not recharge, most modern esc's have a cut off to stop this)

Brushless motor must have a brushless esc, can come as a combo and is almost fit & forget (and no more expensive than brushed combo, cheaper in the long run). I don't know what the slowest brushless is, with a half good transmitter you should be able to turn down the end point to limit speed.

Ah brilliant, think I'll look into lipo/brushless for mine then, and normal brushed motor the other comes with and lipo.

This forum is awesome, learnt more in the last few hours than I have in the last 4 evenings surfing (in fact ended up more confused than when I started).

Thanks alot for the help everyone, and sorry for what are likely to be pretty silly questions :)

Hey, if it help i bought a b4.1 rtr and i am really pleased with it, its super value for money and its really competitive right out of the box.

So much fun.

Yeah, if only they did it fully kit I would be all over it :(

Just looking for a motor/ecm combo, and ezrun got mentioned earlier, and elsewhere in my rsearch but only seem to be able to find them on ebay, with 4 weeks delivery from Hong Kong.

Is this right? or is there a better alternative? as they are much cheaper than the on es I can find in the UK.

OK looking like I may have to go NiMh/brushed set up, I will put out what I have so far with prices, if anyone can advise me from here, no worrys if not, you have all been more than helpfull already :)

Core RC VDC-30 charger £49.99

Associated RC10 B4 Stealth Buggy £139.99 (alternative Ansmann X Pro £79.99)

Ansmann Mad Rat Racing Kit £45

Acoms Techniplus with reciever and 1 servo x 2 £75

This would leave me with about £50 give or take to try and get two lipo batterys and a brushless motor/ecm combo.... not going to happen :)

Though I would have £110 if I went with the Ansmann X Pro, which really still isnt going to happen.

So guess its looking like NiMh and brush motors.

Basicaly my budget is £350 for two cars, one I would like to race with, both need to be kits, I could push to maybe £400 but I would rather stick to my original budget if at all possible.

Think I'm asking to much here :P

May i say something.

Try finding your local indoors venue and have a dab in mardave racing?
Its cheep fun and easy to build cars :)

not at all.....

ansmann mad rat brushed rtr for the young girl.

£90 RTR

http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFun...n&ItemID=33535


b4.1 brushless rtr for yourself

http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFun...n&ItemID=35112

£200 RTR

and if you call dave at roundabout and mention myself a regular customer I know he will give you a better price :p

even at full price that still leaves you £60 for lipos and charger.

do what I did get two turnigy lipos from hobbyking and an imax b6 charger....

and to solve the building it part, pull them apart and try and rebuild them and setting them up.....

cant say any better than this :D

The B4 is a better car than the X-Pro, but if you get your daughter the Madrat, there is a good case for the X-Pro in that they are basically the same car, so you can share spares etc. Got to make life easier doing that.
Ezruns are mainly from Hong Kong. You can get them here, but expect to pay a lot extra for doing so as you are just paying for someone else to import them. Giant Cod sell the speed controller but not the motors, though you can use other motors. Nothing more than a 7.5t though.

You can get cheaper chargers than the Core, though I'd avoid anything that charges at less than 5A.
You can go brushed for now, since a brushed esc costs as little as £24. Please note you'll need two as the Madrat comes with a motor, but no esc. Brushed motors with decent performance can be had for £24 too - the B4/X-pro will need one but your daughter will be fine with the Madrats stock one.


Edit - Actually I'd get the following:
Madrat brushed RTR for daughter.
X-Pro for yourself - build with her. Its virtually identical to her car so the experience is the same.
Radio for the X-Pro
Ezrun .8.5t system for X-Pro
Lipos off hobbyking
Imax charger from the same place

Should be doable inside the budget.

I'm not a buggy racer but I've been racing for about 30 years and am Chairman of the Milton Keynes Club. I can't offer advice on type of buggy but...

My view on this is the idea of 8.5 / 7.5 brushless motors is crazy - far too fast for a beginner. I'd suggest you consider a cheap Ansmann brushed motor, something like a Clash 23 turn brushed motor (RRP £7.95) with a cheap / 2nd hand brushed ESC (you can get a LRP Quantum Pro Sport ESC for about £10 off fleabay). With motors, the lower the number, the faster the impact speed when you crash (and you will) :p

Regarding your affinity for Tamiya, if you have a local indoor club (and seeing as winter's approaching fast) it may be worth finding out if they run a Tamiya Mini class. The Tamiya M03/M05 is durable and cheap to run but provides great fun for all. At the moment our club gets about as many mini racers as it does touring cars. The kits cost around £90 (shop around for bargains), use cheap Ni-MH cells (about £18 each) and as easy to build, drive and cheap to maintain.

HTH
Dave

More good info, thanks alot, could you tell me if the turnigy lipos are BRCA approved? cant see them on the list?

doesnt really matter unless you are raicing in regionals or nationals, which i wont get round to for a long time :p

if your interested im considering some new lipos, and have 2 turnigy lipos 5200mah 30-40c burst that i could sell you for the right price, with deans connectors. all you need then is the imax/tunigy charger. :thumbsup:

Might be interested, what sort of money we talking?

I would like to think some clubs may be a bit more fussy.......

Also note - its that time of year, expect a new list for 2011, don't ask when

Bit of an update, had a chat with the bank manager (the wife) and have a bit better budget, should be able to spend £550 now instead of £350.

So this throws a bit of a spanner in the works, need to start research over a bit lol.

Any recommendations now?

Probably stick to mad rat for the little one, with the motor it comes with, lipo battery of sme sort.

Then whats rest on mine :)

Thanks alot for this, thinking you may be right, sorry I didnt acknowlege this earlier as somehow I missed this reply, not sure how, but when I read the thread back spotted it.

Good advice I think :)

Might buy the brushless/ecm combo and put it in a draw untill I'm more experianced.

This looks nice, think it was posted earlier as well http://www.modelsport.co.uk/?CallFun...n&ItemID=28600

Though a Tamiya Durga sounds interesting as well now with more cash.

Are these a decent car?

Oooooh how about this? http://www.fusionhobbies.com/Product...ctCode=TA84100