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KYOSHO
(http://www.oople.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=10)
what do you fs drivers think???
me and nick have been running the car for over a year now and weve found that when you have the diffs to tight it wants to push going into a corner thats with the independant slipper i know when useing the slipper independantly it can act as a centre diff so if you used it in conjunction with tight diffs is this making the car push going into corners as its making the slipper act as a diff instead of the front diff so i was thinking now most of us are useing the pined slipper could we now run tighter diffs without the car wanting to push and get more drive through and out a corner what do you think guys????? i havent had chance to try it yet!!!
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I now have the slipper pinned and to be honest the front diff is only a little tighter than the rear and not something i would tune with. Due to the amount of weight over the front on and off power steering is very good if anything i am struggling with getting the back end balance (grip) consistant through the whole corner, with the front diff tight or loose the rear was still not right. I am experimenting with rear springs and angles ATM, camber links next.
HTH Simon |
How many people have tried Tony's rudebits kit? I'll be fitting mine to the car and trying it. Not sure how much weight to put in at the mo, but this should surely help settle the rear end a bit more?
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Already have 85g weight in the back spine, i think my problem is shocks on the back as it is hard to get it in and if it slides it is hard to get it back in line.
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I run 60g as does Nick.
From the point of view of plain physics running the shocks on the rear of the wishbone will help free up the suspension movement making it more complient and consistent through it's travel, my shocks are always on the back. The only expection to that is if I really NEED to move the weight forward in which case I run the shocks in the kit position. This is my main concern with the big bores ... lots more weight there so will be a much bigger change moving them front to back As for the question of diff settings it's all a matter of balance but I have always tried to run my diffs as free as is possible without them slipping, front slightly tigher than the rear. I personally still think this is the main benefit from a ball diff, can be right on the verge of slipping but still give good drive and free diff action at the same time ... with a geared diff it's one or the other (hence why I know a few Durango runners are using the Kyosho ball diffs in their cars ;) ). Nick will no doubt be along in a little while to describe the results of the huge amounts of testing he has done around diffs and slipper settings. |
i ran my fs for the the 1st round of worksop , this was my very 1st outing
and wasnt impressed , the car went were it liked not were i wanted to go, nick had a look atthe players meeting last week and staight away told me the diff's are to tight , and proceeded to set them up for me , i was a little suprised when he handed it back to me how loose they are , but i can say its transformed the car 110% better than my 1st outing , so i agree the diffs are usless when tight . cheers nick:thumbsup: |
I'm well impressed with this car.
Running stock FS2 setup, got 60G's in-between LiPo's, pinned the slipper and the diffs are loose! The car is awesome. Had a real good race with Matt today, managed to get him on the inside line a few times so the car must be setup well!! |
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All FS's i saw to day going round looked very good!! Colin May finished up 3rd today... good skills dude! :thumbsup: Cheers Nick :thumbsup: |
Yeah was great day guys with the cars.
I got there in the end of Q shame i didnt do it all in the morning. I can agree big time running rear roll bar made loads of difference too. Yeah Matt & Ry i was catching you both until some certain little non sense happened lol......:p Roll on Worksop :woot: |
Roll bars .... really (I guess ok on carpet tracks). Interesting to understand your thinking and what they are achieving for you on the track.
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no not carpet tracks roger any track,you get more going into the corner as it helps the car pivet, more consistency through the corner and more drive out to as soon as i talked nick into putting his on he was a second a lap faster straight away
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Roll bars on the front, rear or both ends?
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sam your not allowed in here this is kyosho not durango lol but were talking about roll bars on the rear!!
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Ha, im trying to get some inside info from the opposition!!!
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We had a good battle in one run till my car stopped!!
Listen Sam.. youve asked numerous questions about the FS and looked at mine on many occasions... now do just the right thing and buy an FS2!! :p You know you want too... plus imagine a days racing without messing with mucky/messy diffs!! :p Cheers Nick :thumbsup: |
I started off with running ARBs on the FS until I found a way of stabalising the car without them. On tracks like Coventry (think about what you would get if you astro turfed the surface of the moon and left a few edges loose then made the track markings out of land mines:p) the ARBs just make the car far far too unpredictable IMHO.
Admittedly I've not revisited the ARBs since going to permenant 4wd from a one way but then I'm never suffering from lack of pivot on the FS! |
he was looking at my fs sunday to haha and before you ask sam no i dont think the bevel gears in an fs will take a 2.5t motor and 50c lipos lol
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MattB ... I'd actually not bet against it. I've had the same set of gears in mine since it was built and they are still good as new (15 months). My old SP never had a new set when I was running it, also 15 months (but I put a new set in on sale because I'm nice like that).
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Come an play with a proper car Sam :p |
I have to say i think ARB are a quick tuning tool.
If you getting a lot of bite and chassis roll they do lose some grip and help mid corner rotation. I think on loose or bumby surface you want full free travel. |
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Agreed Neil, I always have them with me but rarely find the need for them as the FS is so beautifully balanced nautrally.
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I agree with this on corning entry.. it helps the car go into the corner much more easily, but still sure footed and planted just easier... but through the corner, yes it doesnt roll as much.. but the extra drive and the feeling of the car well and truely planted was a huge difference and to just change this at Chadderton on sunday and go 1sec a lap quicker that should surely tell you whay im trying to explain.. Mattb will tell you i was very reluctant to try the roll bars after not liking them at all outside... but on the the type of indoor smooth surfaces, carpet or worksop type floor i know what i'll be using... im so glad i tried.. With out the bar you can still hug the corners but jump on the power to quick and the back wants to kick out so you have to be smooth on the power delivery... with the bar.. bang and off you go! I reckon if it wasnt for speedo issues i would have been in the A looking at my laptimes in rd4 and my B final.. The top people in the A were on quick 19sec laps.. i was in the same 19 sec a lap bracket but not as quick... usually im 1 sec a lap down on the top guys.. So glad Matt kept on at me to try the bar... cheers dude! Cheers Nick :thumbsup: |
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Lap with you in front! I made a couple of changes to the Durango after a bit of help from Criag Collinson and it felt much better in the final so Its staying for now!(cheers Craig!) |
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When i first tried a bar on Sunday it was the 1mm.. and even that made a difference... i went to the 1.2 and it was even better.. Remember the dusty coventry track for the Mid West regional this year.. well the car was doing exactly what it did at cov on sunday on the corners.. the roll bar sorted it.. so i reckon 1mm for out doors will work on instances like that for sure.. matt has always run them especially on the " looser " tracks" bumpy tracks like cov astro, loads of grip and no kicking out issues.. there no need for one.. :thumbsup: |
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Did a bit of dremel work to give a bit more steering lock and changed the wheelbase a little, oh and swapped my 6.5 for a 5.0 turn, much better!
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I have been asked to say something about the anti roll bar issue. I have been helping out Matt B with his car as he is a very good friend of mine. He loves the car but he just wanted alittle more from it, so he asked for my help. You all know I have driven the car so I do know a little about it. It does under steer on the fast sweepers and the back end is unstable over ripply sections.
It is a very strong car and very reliable car. Back to the anti roll bar. A 4wd car should turn up its own arse when turning with the power on. With the pin out of the slipper this will not do it. It understeers as all the power is going to the front wheels and not the rear. Put the pin in and it will turn on power. Even with the pin in the rear end in THAT planted it will not come round when you waant it to. We have tried all different camber link possitions and alsorts of toe in possitions. Put an anti roll bar on and it will come round. All that this does is take grip off the rear. The thicker the bar the more grip it takes off. It will not effect it over the bumps. If you dont run an anti roll bar then you like a car to understeer. Yes this is the safest way but it is not the fastest. If you watch a Durango, thats what you want it to do but you tone it down to what you like. I bet now, go and see Ellis's car and it will have one on. |
stus right it does not affect the car over the bumps with a roll bar on to get the rear planted over the bumps you just need to get the anti squat and the damping right.
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That depends on the bumps.
If they are hitting one wheel only it tends to unsettle the car. Bear in mind the Anti roll bar is just that, it keeps the car level under load in the turn. Correct damping can compensate this but on a track with differnt cornering forces and jump requirements getting the overall balance is the trick. BTW i nearly always run ARB. But then i always race on high consistent grip without too many bumps. Lately i have ben running front only and it seems real safe in the corners. |
fs2 arb
my preference at stotfold is to run both roll bars like it says in the fs2 kit with silver springs on the front and blue on the rear, its so safe to drive and it seems to land so well with the small size shocks.
as for shocks on the rear, it has loads of traction as standard and you dont want to lose steering, if anything it needs less ackermann imo |
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Ellis sets his cars up to run without roll bars, they make cars very unpredictable. |
i feel anti roll bars are a great tuning aid but a lot of it is personel prefrence in my view ive run the car with and without and for me the car feels a little vague and looses traction which we know but what i do feel with them especialy my car is the car has the same charistics as my touring cars had when i tried them. like i said its personel preference for me its a no dont run them but i will tend to alter the roll centers shock oils etc anti squat etc before going down roll bar route.
car is pretty good. stu rand |
The whole roll bar thing will be a personal preference for sure..
I'll report back after worksop this weekend and give you my verdict.. but im certain on the type of worksop surface similar to chadderton it will be where im at with regards set up... Ive posted arNo my setups which he has put up on petit rc in the kyosho section under the setups tab if anyone is interested.. Nick :thumbsup: |
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