Lipos, how to get approval.
 

Anyone know what the procedure is to get lipos approved on the BRCA list?

I've heard it costs £40?

I've been talking with a few people about putting a few quid in each to get lower cost lipos approved. It'll save us all money in the long run over having to buy the much higher cost big brand cells.

I just don't know where to start.

You need to contact Paul Worsley. Paul's contact details are in the BRCA handbook.

Neil

Read this:

http://www.brca.org/content/electric-board/1396

and this:

http://www.brca.org/content/battery-...procedure/1399

G

I'm sure you have to be an importer and that's the point as long as there are uk sellers and after sales service the addition may only be £40
I could be very wrong but sure I read it somewhere

i looked at a few of the new shorty packs and some no one sells in the uk lol.

id love to do this too

get the Turnigy Nanotechs Saddle/shorty packs approved

very popular and cheap too

shame these cant be used a regionals/nationals though

It's not the money that is the issue...it's all supporting information and manufacturing data that you won't be able to deal with!

Part of the process is to get some base line safety, quality control and responsibility in place for a technology that has some degree of volatility to it.

So unless you want to start digging around with the manufacturers and how they make the cheap cells...and then take responsibility for them in the long term...you really have no hope!

Product certification in all industries is an absolute mine field...although this one will be relatively simple compared to a lot of other consumer/medical/industrial standards, you really won't want to go there! There is a reason cheap cells aren't on that list...and are cheap! ;)

Why are they (nano tech cells) ROAR approved then?

As the distributor/submitter your also answerable to any safety issues that arise from the product.

Don't forget, public liability to...

Ask the UK distributor..........

It's not a secret process, all of the info is on the web page, if the UK distributor wanted them to be on the BRCA lists they could follow that process.

Or alternatively you can put a proposal in at the AGM to do maybe the following - remember if you propose it and it gets to the vote you can change the rules

1) ROAR approved batteries to be automatically allowed on the approved list as last time I checked its the same process as BRCA regarding dimensions, case etc
And if the Americans can approve based on their ideals then why shouldn't the rest of the IFMAR blocks accept automatically?

2) vote out the use of batteries from the BRCA list only and insist on hard case cells only

Personally I much prefer my nano techs over any of my BRCA approved batteries - they are cheaper, perform at least as good if not better, balance well and don't seem to lose any performance over a run compared to my others.

Not sure why some people instantly think that if something is cheap it means its an inferior product. It's fairly well known that bigger brand companies charge more for items (in all areas of business)

I'm not going to pretend I know how the BRCA add batteries to the list, but imo just because they're not on the list, it doesnt make them dangerous. If you look around most club meets, you'll probably see more Turnigy than anything else. If they kept blowing up or didnt last, people wouldnt bother with them. If they were on the list, then you'd probably see even more than you currently see!

No reason nanotech shouldn't be on that list. I see far more of these than any other battery around here.
But after a few years of them already being widely used I suspect there is more to it than meets the eye...

Luniemiester statements are right. If you want to change the rules of the BRCA then the membership will need to get behind this, put a proposal together for the AGM and vote with their feet, attend the next BRCA AGM and cast their votes.

To stir up a hornets nest many of the BRCA rules are out dated but unless the membership puts together some proposals and get of their backsides to vote the in nothing will change.

Cheaper than recognised brands does NOT equal poor quality. I deal with a number of electronics and lipo suppliers in the far east and many of the non approved lipos have exactly the same lipo inside as the one on the BRCA/ROAR approved lists and the same goes for speedos and motors but for many suppliers who are just interested in the fun/basher market they are not going to pay to have their product on the approved lists.

Hardcased lipos charged in a charging sack should be more than sufficient for regional events as should commercially available motors and speedo. The BRCA retain the right to inspect anyone equipment if anyone is suspected of cheating so there are rules in place should they be needed.

More cost effective racing should be encouraged in these austere times and cheaper equipment is a major factor for bringing new people into our sport as any returning racer with bear testament to. You speak to any racer coming out of retirement and they cant believe the prices compared to the days of nicads and brushed motors!

If you want to change the rules you need to get the membership to change them from within.

TBH, with such a limited pool of actual lipo manufacturers, as opposed to "lipo labellers", I'd not be in the slightest bit surprised if the actual nasty bit of the battery isn't already approved under half a dozen or more other names already.

Agreed.
When lipos first were introduced many companies just slapped a sticker on Intellect packs and doubled the price....

Maybe the thing to do is knock up some 'Reedy' or similar stickers and pop them on our Turnigy cells - it's just what various companies did to us - but in reverse :)

Unlike the US distributor, the UK distributor has chosen not to submit any batteries for approval -Nothing more than that!

If you want them on the list, go badger the distributor as they are the ones not doing their job. But it is too late for this year's 2S list.

they have been asked too by some people in the know and declined to put them forward.

We'll need to get this sorted at the next AGM.

They have been approved by one of the three IFMAR Blocks, ROAR, and in my mind, a higher authority than the BRCA in global terms. So surely, if its good enough for them, its good enough for us.

When is the next agm?

Has anybody asked Paul Worsley? This should be first step..

Food for thought (I hope...)

As someone new to racing, and trying to set up and get going as quickly as possible, I have found the Turnigy LiPo's the obvious solution for my needs. As I look further into the year there are events I would like to attend (regionals etc) that are covered by the BRCA limitations.

To race in these events therefore I will need to adhere to the list of approved packs, however I am still yet to find a list of what is and isn't approved, now this could be a failure in my abilities to navigate the BRCA website (which I would fully accept) either way that would highlight an area that is difficult for new members to find.

Ideally the BRCA would hope to increase the amount of new members looking to get involved with racing competitively, it should be important to have a value manufacturer like Turnigy available to racers. I hope the manufacturer changes its mind and drives to have its packs approved.

Just buy one approved pack and use of that in the bigger brca sanctioned meetings. There are cheap approved packs out there for those on a tight budget.

BRCA approval is more about liabilities than technical performance. hobbyking turnigy packs perform well technically but without a UK company ready to back their product up its a none starter, so don't hold your breath waiting for hobbyking to get approval on their packs. the UK racer market is small fry for them anyway. it won't help them sell any more serious volume anyway. they sell far more soft case flight packs that don't require the approval process that the brca stipulate.

I to use Turnigy. the only thing is, If these lipo's get approved would the prise go up.

I have struggled to find a cheap shorty lipo On the list. This are supposed to be ready avaliable.

the lists:

http://www.brca.org/sites/www.brca.o...0v1%20pdf2.pdf

http://www.brca.org/sites/www.brca.o...0v1%20pdf2.pdf

Gens ace saddles and sticks are cheap enough, but they haven't got their shorty on the list.

Intellect and HPI shorties are at the cheaper end, and I think the nvision is as well. Not turnigy cheap, but I have one approved shorty for big meetings, and a few turnigies for club racing, plus approved saddles.

Hopefully not - so many people are using them anyway I can't see a huge surge in demand if they get approved.

I've never had my LIPOs checked during a regional so the chances are that if you choose to run a "non-approved" lipo at a BRCA event, you'd probably get away with it.

You could also borrow a mate's BRCA LIPO for scrutineering and then stick in the Turnigy when nobody is looking;)

Seriously, i am no supporter of the battery lists, but suggesting breaking the rules is not a clever thing to do. Think how you would feel if half a dozen racers followed your advice and were disqualified in an event. maybe you could even suggest they slip a third cell in as well :p.

Hopefully the rules will be relaxed in time, but until then there is no point trying to circumvent them as its only the racers that will lose out.

My own personal feeling is that if a battery is safe to sell in the UK, and is used as per the manufacturers guidelines, then there is no reason that the BRCA should ban then on "safety" grounds. As far as i am aware the Turnigy cells are sold legally in the uk, and are used within their safe charge and discharge ratings. If the BRCA really want to open up racing and introduce more blood, this needs to be addressed.

+1
I also have never been checked but if I was hitting the A final at regional then I bet I would be.

Deleted upon request.

Roar a higher authority!! Now you are having a laugh....they have less members than the BRCA by some margin. IFMAR/EFRA/BRCA have identical rules, Roar doesn't!

The lists are for BRCA events which the Regionals are too.

Thats true, Regionals are BRCA sanctioned which is why the BRCA rules have to be followed.

Just to be clear, my previous post wasn't an intended to be an open encouragement for all to break to rules, but simply highlighting the fact that scrutineering is more focused on weights, dimensions, tyres etc, and therefore running non-legal LIPOs is unlikely to be picked up on.

Nobody should actively break rules, but if you are a club racer who has never attended a regional before, it can be off-putting knowing that your equipment, that you may have spent a small fortune on, is not legal despite your local club not having an issue with them.

Can someone explain why the BRCA should change the rules that work just so a distributor can avoid paying the costs all the others pay?

Electric Board changes are proposed by your Section EB rep and taken to an EB meeting. Talk to your EB rep first.

what are the costs that the other distributors pay?

Er the BRCA do not ban anything. The BRCA apply rules as voted for by the racers, is you.. If you sit at home on the last Sunday in every October then blame yourself!!
All hard case lipos can be used in all BRCA clubs and the BRCA insurance covers you. That's laid down in general rules.
The sections we race in may choose to use the EB list of approved batteries for that section, again voted for by the racers, there is no legislation that sections have to use the EB list. If the voters vote not to use the EB list, they do not have to.

Top of my head £40 for each cell submitted and the loss of each cell submitted.

to be 100% the figure is in the application form on the BRCA EB site

Mark, are you sure about that statement?