Introduction of Lipo???
 

Just out of interest, if you do not want Lipo to be introduced to your club/regional/national racing scene, why?

WOOPS just read your post again hehe. Ignore

DO NOT idiot! :woot:

Learn to read. :p

G

hehe:blush: Anyway back to toms post. I dont think you will get a reply tom.... simply because. Lipo's are ACE :woot:

well, if you listen to some, they burst into flames without cause or warning..... and that is less dangerous than a NiMH cell exploding in your presence... I don't know....

Bring on LIPO!!!

I think its a backward step to not allow lipo. We are now on evolution 4 lipo. evo 1 and 2 were unstable. evo 3 was far better but some problems now with evo 4 they are very safe as long as people charge to the correct rate . how many meetings have people been to where a pack of nimh's have gone bang. there are too many myths and rumour regarding lipo. if there were that bad the brca touring car section wouldnt be using them.

Cheers for the posts guys, but I'm really looking for reason's from people who do not want them introduced.

I already know the advantages, that's why I use them :thumbsup:

Tom....

I don't want Li-po's to be used because I have to pay for them unlike everyone else it seems......

That is unless some one wants to give me some....

JIm

ill loan you a stick pack jim!!

do you buy nimh now?

I've just got some....so sorry Tom I can't tell you a reason for 'why not'.

:thumbsup:

Reason for lipo- maybe the days of team cells being so much better than what joe public can get over the counter etc will be gone, with lipo brushless in the old 4wd just how fast can we go:woot::thumbsup:. Also we may only need a couple of sets rather than a couple of cases of batterys.

Reason not- I can take my £100+ chargers & all my sets of mega money batterys that set me back a few houndred quid and oh yer my £100+ muchmore discharger and chuck them in the bin cos they wont be worth jack s**t!! and come to that my 4wd lipo wont fit in so I can chuck that in the bin two:o.........All that will make next year very costly, errr and the way money is at the min I don't think I would bother.

In 2wd you will need a bit of lead to hit the weight limit:p.

The thing is once you make lipo legal you realy have no choice, get lipo and lipo chargers for 300+ ish, or go fishing

They can be run together, people ran NIMH's & lipo at last years Worksop series & the Belgium GP in the same meeting!

what car does lipo not fit in?

That depends very much on the make of LiPo. You'll find a few that will struggle to fit in a B4/XXX because the wires exit the hard case at the side and not the end/top. This makes them WWWIIIIDDDEEEE.

But, if you were to buy the right make then they would be able to fit in all cars. Is this right? Not that i have any but there are a few guys running them at club in tourers and they seem so simple compared to nimh.
Sorry, back to topic.

The only downside i have is the resale value of old kit, hey ho, i've had my moneys worth out of it:thumbsup:

Think S4 is a bit of a challenge isn't it?

OK then a question to all....

Do you see it as a must that for a specific make of LiPo cell should fit a standard off the shelf car (ie, B4, XXX etc) without modification to either car or cell, before it is allowed to be homologated?

yes, it must, it should fit in as a replacement cell, it makes it far more transferable. I know with some of the packs (yungtong for starters) you need a small dremmel work to clear the output cables, is that acceptable, I would think so, but hacking a chassis to make em fit... no

"ill loan you a stick pack jim!!"

"do you buy nimh now?"

Hey Mark,

Unfortunatly I do still part with hard earned cash for all my racing gear:blush:

After all the years I've been racing you'd think people would sponsor me out of pitty:woot:

JIm

Yes for sure, I think the rule should be lipo should fit straight in the car with no chassis modification exept for maybe washers under battery posts etc, but we should not have to chop the chassis about.

I think they should have to be between a pair of fixed dimenions.

A

don't they exist in three dimensions ????

It'd be difficult to make a rule on fitting specific cars, dimensions is much easier.

But, as a downside, then yeah definitely I think potentially for some people it will be a pain to make them fit. Those more comfortable with dremelling/cutting parts of chassis etc need to remember a lot of people really don't have the skills/inclination for that! With how difficult it is getting new blood into the hobby, I don't think advanced DIY being added as a prerequisite is a good idea!

Still, with a Lipo version S4 being seen (well, people have modified them or something to fit Lipo yeah?) there's not much the low capacity saddle Lipo's don't fit in pretty easily! I know they go in X5's (thanks to Chris Long showing me!) with little mods, they go in BX4's, I think they go in Tamiya's with just some battery post changes too? I'm sure I've seen B44's with them too!?

Dave

Ill put it a diffrent way i mean it they should fall within a set range on dimensions so it must be bigger then H x L x D but smaller than H x L x D.

A

jim, not having a go but I pay for my gear with my own money and the occasional loan from my dad, and I'm on peanuts for a wage :p

But I say bring on lipo! You can get 2 yeah racing lipos for £38 on some sites and there awesome!

my thoughts are they should fit all the cars witout modification,
no dremmelling at all,
then its up to the racer to make the decision for themselves:thumbsup:


trekkker

I`m all for lipo and im looking forward to giving them a run at the worksop series but i have to agree with some of the posts regarding being able to fit into all cars without hacking bits out of them. A manufacture should not forfit sales just because battery technology has changed and this could happen. I would hate to see the racing scene lose a tope end chassis such as an S4 just because it could not accomodate a lipo pack :(

I think you are all getting confused, LiPo does not really offer any on-track advantage of nmhi

its the off-track benefits that makes everyone pro-LiPo isn't it?

as has been pointed out, worksop series, LiPo and nmhi mixed it up all the way through the grid at that meeting.

just because a car does not fit 'regular' LiPo cells does not mean it is at a dis-advantage.

I would be perfectly happy to run an S4 type car on nmhi that I ran this year against ANY electric technology you like in your car, I know that my car was boarderline too fast for its self and the 'right' weight that I wanted.

actualy, I got to disagree with your first point there Chris.... for those who can't afford/justify buying the upper range of NiMH, there is a performance increase, plus there isn't a drop off in performance as the cells discharge. There is also not the AV drop-off as the cells age either, LiPo lose capacity not voltage.

I do think it really does level the playing field, for the club racer to the national driver... LiPo and brushless does, to a point, allow club drivers to run the same gear and power and performance as the likes of yourself though..... which is good.

I should have been clearer, Chris, i meant someone may choose a different car because it will accept lipo.

Like when the Cat SX was first rumoured people were saying they would only buy it if it was lipo friendly :)

It could be the grip levels aren't that high at Worksop, so any additional power can't really be used. Where as on high grip tracks (Kiddy, Stotfold, EPR) the difference may be more noticable.

As DCM says there's no noticable drop off in performance, so surely the LiPo advantage will be more apparent at the end of a race.

do you really think that more speed is needed than even a basic nmhi pack and a 4.5 ??

If/when Lipo becomes legal in 10th off road there will be a lot more companies bringing out packs that have different configuration of wires/output, if you looked at the brca touring guys, there was only 4 packs on it at the start and now there is over 16, at the moment there is only a few companys that do saddle cells as its quite an investment to produce, as soon as they see there is a market they will follow!!!
So most cars should be able to fit something!

Not really, but the voltage charactoristics are still a big difference from NiMH.

My biggest negative point is the fitment into individual cars, and it need to be without modification to either cell or chassis.

Speed advantages are in the drivers thumbs....which is why I'm not good!:p

Seriously though, you could have the fastest LiPo'd, brushless'd car on the track. If you can't drive then its no advantage. The fast guys will still be the fast guys. They're like that for a reason.

I could put a 5000 lipo and a 2.5 brushless in my car, and I'd still get beat by Cragg running Nihm and a stock motor!

Yes cost is a factor for most (including myself), but I always have to sell older stuff before I buy newer stuff. That way, you don't have to put as many pennies towards your new products.
Club racers will always buy your old gear, and some will even pay near the retail value for it if its in good condition.

Regarding 'modification' to chassis. That would need to be clarified. Would removing the battery trays from a D4 be classed as 'modifying the chassis'?

I think modifying, would have to be clarified, along the lines of any non reversable changes such as dremelling things out to get the cells in etc

I'm not saying I want more voltage, just that it's not really an entirely level playing field.

i think years ago when the capacity of cells wasn't what they are now, and you struggled to last, the performance difference between LiPo and NiMH would've been way more apparent. Nowadays, if you've not got enough speed, you can just slat a faster motor in the car, yet not even come close to using the full capacity of cells.

There are limits to what power you can use in an off road car without making it too just too difficult to drive (grip limits etc), so i really can't see a performance related benefit of running LiPo in off road.

I ran LiPo in my X6 at the weekend, with a Novak 7.5L, and it was more than enough power. I was slowly adding weight to the car to get it to the same weight levels as it was with NiMH, so power really isn't a factor

The benefits of LiPo in terms of usage totally outclasses NiMH though. I have one pack for 2wd, one pack for 4wd, and just recharge the same pack after a race. No matter how long i run for, both cars' electrics came off cold! Overall, the cost of 2 packs of LiPo TrakPower 3200's cost me 90 quid (ish), cheaper than the numerous packs of cells i would've eventually bought for the new season.

As for fitting LiPo in the cars. I agree with some of the comments about attracting newbies into the sport, and them maybe having to mod the car to make it LiPo friendly. However, there are quite a few cars that still require some form of dremeling to get them race ready!

to be honest, i'd be gutted if we couldn't run LiPo next year, racing has become so much easier since i've tried LiPo:drool::drool::drool::drool:

I think the power advantage you get with lipo would be of very little benefit to 75% of offroaders as it isn't how fast your car is but it's hgoing to be those pesky thumbs at the end of the day. Doughty proved this using my car in one leg of the a final at epr and still very much on the pace. I couldn't get the car any where near that fast around the track.
The main benefit as stan said, is a couple of packs for both classes and reuseable all day:thumbsup:. There has been alot of people this year who have had cells go down in packs and have not replaced them purely because lipo is the future and there is no point in replacing damaged nimh's.(myself included)
I'll be using lipo as much as i can over the winter and club racing because it saves all the charging,discharging and equalising routine that seems to take a lifetime.
As for car fitment, at the level of racing that we are talking about, i think people will do whatever they have to so as to make their cars lipo compatible(if they feel they are at a disadvantage using nimh). They will fit every car with very little mods to the chassis inc. the s4(see doddy's thread)

im pretty sick of people thinking that team drivers ahve faster equipment and thats why they beat other drivers....seriously are you kidding me?

you can buy the same batteries of the shelf....maybe even better..team cells aer not sorted, they're just picked from the shelf at the factory!

And i know it hurts to pay for things....but if we didnt then our hobbie shops and our hobbie would die out!

shame really...........